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  • #1

    Way out in space off-topic

    I was just watching a clip from Star Trek: Wrath of Khan. Spock is allowing Lt. Saavik to pilot the Enterprise out of space dock. He says "Take her out, Mr. Saavik."



    Saavik is clearly not a "mister." Somebody responded to my question about that by saying she's an officer aboard the Enterprise and thus "in this universe" the "Mister" is correct.

    It makes no sense to me, not least because Uhura has always been an officer on the Enterprise and I'm sure she was referred to as "Miss Uhura" on several occasions in TOS.
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  • #2
    In Hong King cop movies even female supervisors are called 'sir'. In Star Wars every Jedi of rank is a master regardless of gender or lack thereof. In the HK example I think it's just a mark of respect (HK cop movies are heavily male) while Star Wars I think it's just easier considering aliens could be anything, gender-wise. For Star Trek I would guess it means in the future people aren't differentiated by sex to be more equal. Back in the 60s I guess no one thought of that so they still used gendered titles? (just my guess, I am not a huge ST fan).
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    • #3
      They just use Mister for officers. My guess is because some officers are a species that doesn't use him/her, mister/ma'am so they defaulted to mister for all officers.

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      • #4
        Occams Razor: It was filmed in the '60s.
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        • #5
          It's my understanding that the same is true IRL, as well, at least in the (US) Navy - Officers are often called "Mister/Sir." I dunno if that has changed over the years.
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          • #6
            Quoth EricKei View Post
            It's my understanding that the same is true IRL, as well, at least in the (US) Navy - Officers are often called "Mister/Sir." I dunno if that has changed over the years.
            I think you're right, Eric.

            If I'm not mistaken, in Star Trek, they use Naval ranking conventions (albeit, they seem to leave a LOT of them out, probably for simplicity).

            I was watching ST: TNG once and heard someone answer a female officer with "Aye, Sir" when given a command, so I'm guessing it's a military thing.

            Side Note: In TNG (which is the one I'm the most familiar with), rankings on the Enterprise seem to go: Ensign, Lieutenant Junior Grade, Lieutenant, Lieutenant Commander, Commander, Captain. I know there are more than five ranks ("Chief", as in Chief O'Brien, for instance), but they never really talk about other ranks. Maybe that's all that's on board the Enterprise. It's just officers.

            I say this because my dad (rest his soul) was a AMH3 (Petty officer 3rd class, worked on aircraft hydraulics). And there's like 12 NCO ranks, or something like that.
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            • #7
              When I was in the navy (1985-1995) female officers were ma'am. That of course may have changed after I got out.

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              • #8
                Quoth mjr View Post
                I think you're right, Eric.

                If I'm not mistaken, in Star Trek, they use Naval ranking conventions (albeit, they seem to leave a LOT of them out, probably for simplicity).
                Surprisingly enough, the first time they started using military references like this was Wrath of Khan, it's one of the things Nicholas Meyers (prolly Star Trek's best director) brought to the story, and it pissed Roddenberry off like you wouldn't believe.
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                • #9
                  Quoth mjr View Post
                  I know there are more than five ranks ("Chief", as in Chief O'Brien, for instance), but they never really talk about other ranks. Maybe that's all that's on board the Enterprise. It's just officers.
                  O'Brien wore 2 pips in NG (Lieutenant) from what I've been able to find, but Memory Alpha says he was maybe a (Chief??) Warrant Officer on DS9 (a commissioned rank).


                  Here's the IRL Navy ranks list for comparison.
                  "For a musician, the SNES sound engine is like using Crayola Crayons. Nobuo Uematsu used Crayola Crayons to paint the Sistine Chapel." - Jeremy Jahns (re: "Dancing Mad")
                  "The difference between an amateur and a master is that the master has failed way more times." - JoCat
                  "Thinking is difficult, therefore let the herd pronounce judgment!" ~ Carl Jung
                  "There's burning bridges, and then there's the lake just to fill it with gasoline." - Wiccy, reddit
                  "Retail is a cruel master, and could very well be the most educational time of many people's lives, in its own twisted way." - me
                  "Love keeps her in the air when she oughta fall down...tell you she's hurtin' 'fore she keens...makes her a home." - Capt. Malcolm Reynolds, "Serenity" (2005)
                  Acts of Gord – Read it, Learn it, Love it!
                  "Our psychic powers only work if the customer has a mind to read." - me

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                  • #10
                    There was an episode in the original series in which a female crewmember was referred to as "mister", I can't remember the name of it, but it was the one in which two crewmembers were going to be married and one of them (I believe it was the man) was killed in the course of the story. This was of course filmed in the 60s. It always struck me as weird that they used "mister" but I got the impression that it was a general form of address to someone below you (whoever is speaking) in rank.
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                    • #11
                      Quoth EricKei View Post
                      O'Brien wore 2 pips in NG (Lieutenant) from what I've been able to find, but Memory Alpha says he was maybe a (Chief??) Warrant Officer on DS9 (a commissioned rank).


                      Here's the IRL Navy ranks list for comparison.
                      That's was one of the ongoing issues with O'Brian was his rank. At some points he is shown 2 pips, then later on in TNG, he is shown with 1 'empty' pip. By the time he gets over to DSN, they have him with stripes.
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