Cat spraying help?

[zombiequeen]

All right, I guess I'll start here at the beginning.
Hubby and I moved into his grandparent's house just over a month ago, with their two charming 12 year old cats. Yay, Sal (the fat polydactly one) is a big attention lover, and Radar (also known as Sir Fluffypants) is shy, but seems to love me. They were introduced (basically flung in the general direction of each other) at age 2 when they brought Sal home and decided to keep him, even though he and Radar tore into each other. They're both front-declawed, fixed male cats. For the most part they coexist, but they get into major fights every week or so. It's pretty disturbing.
They also spray EVERYWHERE. The whole house smells of cat piss. The basement is piss-central, as well as the kitchen. I have to close off the upstairs because they'll come up and spray on all of mine and hubby's stuff otherwise, or try to attack our lizard through her cage.
Today I had to clean the ENTIRE kitchen counter because one of them decided to spray all the food canisters, all of my bottles, and everything else. Hubby didn't get any kool-aid for work because everything was coated in a thick layer of cat spray. I wiped it all down with windex, because it's ammonia based so I wouldn't get sick.
So what should I do about these cats? The grandparents don't care about them spraying everything, not even when the cats get their coffee cups and spoons that they leave out on the counter. THEY DON'T EVEN RINSE THEM OFF!
When I told them about the cats spraying, gramma said "It's not a big issue, they're inside cats so you can't get sick from it. Either way, they don't do it that often. I haven't smelled cat spray in years." She can't smell it because she's probably used to it!
Also, both cats have personality and digestive issues. Radar was a feral cat, and he throws up/poos everywhere at least once a week. Sal will gorge himself, and then throw up someplace once in a great while.

What do you guys think I should do about it? The grandparents don't care, and they both don't trust anything I do because of my FIL's meddling.

[MaggieTheCat]

I think I just threw up a little.

It sounds like both of the cats need to have vet exams. Do your grandparents take them in for yearly checkups? My guess is no. If they haven't, are you allowed and can you afford to take them in? That would be the first step, at least in determining why the one cat throws up a lot. One of our cats (our oldest boy, he's about 13 or 14) gets indigestion early in the morning (like 4am early) and used to cough/throw up water and bile. He's on a medication now that's basically an antacid and it helps a lot. A vet can also help with the spraying problems. It's possible there is something physically wrong with the cats, like a UTI, that is causing them to go outside the litterbox.

Speaking of the litterbox, do they use it at all? Is it well maintained and cleaned regularly? Do they seem to like the litter that is being used? Is there more than one box that they have easy access to? All of these things can contribute to a cat not going in a box.

I've never had to deal with a cat spraying, but to at least keep them off the kitchen counters or tables, you could try either getting a ssscat mat or some double-sided tape. Ssscat mats will give the cat a little jolt when they jump on it -- it shouldn't hurt them, but it will be unpleasant. Double-sided tape will stick to their paws, which they also don't like.

[zombiequeen]

The litterboxes are in the entryway, there's two of them and they are filthy. I'm not allowed to clean them however, because I'm a young woman and could get toxoplasmosis (although I bet I already have it from having to clean up cat pee constantly!). Grandpa is supposed to do it but I don't think he has been. I don't know where the litter or scooper is either.
Hubby is thinking of finding the paperwork on the cats and calling about the vet exams, because he doesn't think they've had one in years. Radar used to be on medication for his stomach, but they couldn't afford it so they stopped giving it to him.
When grandpa feeds them in the morning, he wants Radar up on the counter so Sal won't bully him. No chance of me stopping the cats from getting on the counter.
I really just want the cats to be better off I guess. I know what they need, to be separated and given thorough exams, but I'm not allowed to do anything at this point. I feel like I did when Spiggit got sick, helpless right now.
Hubby says if it gets too much worse, he'll take Radar (he sneaks outside sometimes) to a shelter on the other side of the city and tell grandma he got outside and disappeared. At least then there's not two cats that hate each other in the house. I don't think it's right, though.

[zombiequeen]

All right, I did find the scooper, and I'll dig around the basement to see if there's any kitty litter. If not, I'll pick some up Thursday or Friday when hubby and I do our errands.
I have a big pair of rubber gloves I use to clean the bathroom, is there anything I should do to them so I don't get sick (I think I used them with bleach-based cleaners at some point)? If not, I can have hubby bring me a pair of disposable ones from his work.
Sadly, Hubby has argued with them for years on the cats, they've always just pulled the whole "Well we're old, and we like the cats, so everyone else has to deal with whatever is going on." They aren't exactly...mature. They let Sal and Radar bully another cat to death at one point, because they figured they would get along with her eventually.
Do you think cleaning the boxes (and I'll make sure they stay clean!) will decrease the spraying? Or is it possibly too ingrained in the cat's brains to spray?
Could it be their diet? Gramma+grandpa feed them from the table, I don't feed them, but the cats get probably as much food from table scraps (mostly red meat, fish once a week) as they do moist and dry cat food.

EDIT: Looked up the symptoms, hubby and I started exhibiting some within a week of moving in here, and gramma +grandpa have had them too. We probably already have toxoplasmosis.
I'm going to call my MIL and tell her about what's going on, she might be able to get through to them that something's wrong.

[zombiequeen]

Thank you so much! I was about to cry because I'm so confused by how the cats are behaving.
I found the kitty litter too, they have it in a container in the basement, probably to keep the cats out of the bags.
The cat's pee is thick sticky orange, and smells terrible, it's definitely different than normal cat-spray. Hubby said he'd talk to them in the morning about taking the cats to a vet, and we'll pay for it. They should have no reason to say no.
I left all of the sprayed-on bottles in the sink so they know the cats did it again, it's pretty potent smelling.

Is it normal for older cats to have back-spasms? I've noticed Sal gets them every time he walks, but they're sometimes so bad he has to lay down for a few minutes until they go away. It's like the normal muscle-twitch running down the back, but his keeps going up and down his back until he lays down. He seems rather annoyed with it too.

[protege]

It could be because of the litterboxes, but it could also be because there are 'new' people in 'their' house. Some cats don't do well when things change.

For example, when I first brought my grandmother's cat, Kitty, to live with me, he wasn't too happy about things. He'd previously had the run of an 80-acre farm, and spent most of his time outside. Since people drive like assholes on my street, and because many of the neighbors had dogs...Kitty would have to stay inside.

Even though he'd been trained to use a litterbox when he was a kitten, I sometimes found cat pee in various places around the house. Most of the time he used the 'box, but I'd find wet boxes downstairs, puddles on the (crappy) living room carpet. I don't know if he was still upset about the 1.5-hour car ride (he hated his carrier) home, or if he was just scared about the move. After about a week, he settled down, and the 'accidents' went away. Of course I had to bribe him with treats and "good kitty!" but he learned.

[zombiequeen]

Thanks.
The peeing has been going on for years, apparently. I casually asked grandpa when they took them to the vet last and it was at least three years ago. But he said the peeing has been on and off since they got Sal (that would be 10 years!)
Told him that it smelled like something was wrong, because neutered cats have normal smelling pee. He can't personally smell it, but he said he'd try to find the vet papers for me to at least call tomorrow. I know he's worried about his babies, that's a good sign. He'll probably forget to get the papers, but hubby wants to sit them both down tomorrow and talk to them.
Radar's the one who smells like the pee all the time, so I bet it's him who has the infection. Sal might too, I had to clean him up today, his bum was quite messy.
I think the back-spasms are new, grandpa didn't know about them. He did say that they didn't even notice cat pee until hubby and I moved in, so it might be stress combined with young people that notice things.
I'm going to go clean the boxes now, and I'll just tell grandpa that I'll do it from now on, out of concern for his back issues he's been having.

Update: cleaned the boxes, the one had a lot of puke in it. I let grandpa know and he's supposed to talk to grandma about it tonight. Hopefully this will help get the cats to the vet.

[Seshat]

Cat pee should be thin pale yellow. Orange can imply blood in the urine, and thick means they either have a kidney infection or they aren't getting enough liquid.

Cat spraying is a territory behaviour, or a 'something is wrong' behaviour. What's wrong can be as simple as 'the litter box smells like the other cat'.

Dirty litter boxes is almost a guarantee that the cat will pee someplace else.

[zombiequeen]

Well, I spoke with Grandma and grandpa this morning, and explained what I thought about the cat pee. Of course, now Grandma thinks I'm trying to take her cats and get them put to sleep (I would NEVER do that, I don't know where she got that from) so I'm not allowed their vet information or anything. It's like six steps backwards from yesterday.
I let them know that I thought there was blood in the cat spray and that was a sign of an infection, and grandma went on about how she was a nurse (for people) and she knows an infection when she sees one, and it's just the cats being territorial.
Of course, hubby was already gone for work, and I couldn't get a word in edgewise, so I just came upstairs.
Sal is doing better today, I was petting him and his back didn't twitch or anything. Maybe it's when it's too warm that he gets the twitchy spine?

[MaggieTheCat]

It also is completely unfair to you and your husband that your grandparents are exposing you to all of this without giving a flying shit about your health, safety, or wishes. Even if what the cats were doing wasn't a health hazard -- which it is -- they still are completely disregarding your wishes to keep the cats off the counters where you prepare food, away from your belongings, etc. This is not a good environment for you to be living in.

I would take those cats to the vet, with or without grandmother's permission or knowledge...but I don't know your situation fully, either. Would she go so far as to kick you out if you did that? I would deal with the consequences after taking them in, but you have to judge for yourself if you can risk those consequences.

[zombiequeen]

Here in western Michigan, no vet will let you in without proof of rabies vaccinations, and feline leukemia info. That's why I need the vet papers. The only way I wouldn't is if I dropped them off at a shelter, but none of the shelters here take cats right now, or they kill them immediately.
Hubby has also been trying to get grandma's brain tested, she has every sign of Alzheimers, but she says it's grandpa that's getting it and refuses to get tested. So I guess she would prevent humans from getting medical attention to prove her point. I seem to get all of the uncaring relatives. When I told her that she should at least get them checked up so they live longer, she called me a hippy liberal that saves pets but kills kids (??????) and I had to go upstairs so I wouldn't blow up at her. I guess she sees my concern for the cats as an attempt to control her and grandpa, that's why she's being so stupid about it.
I gave both kitties catnip because I know it helps Sal feel better, and somehow it helps Radar's stomach.
Radar threw up three times, in three different places in their bedroom earlier, and when I said that's not normal, grandma said it's just hairballs, and that's why his pee smells funny too.
If it weren't for the whole "We will euthanize ALL new cats because we have too many" thing, I would drop at least Radar off at a shelter, pay the vet bill, and get him to a better place.

Maggiethecat: It's a power struggle with my grandma right now. She resents me being here, because I'm a strong willed woman that takes charge of myself. I doubt we'd get kicked out, because I know how to play this as a "kitty got outside and I think he was hit" thing, or even a "he puked blood on me, he's going to the vet" but I don't know how it would work out. If hubby and I hadn't had to use our savings, it would be no question. However, due to a car scare and my insurance quitting, we have no money until the end of the month at least. I'll ask hubby what he thinks, because he knows where the money needs to go. Maybe we can get them into a vet with a payment plan, I'll just sneak down and go through their papers or something to find the vet info.

[kpzra]

All of their shots are expired by now. Every vet I've ever used in Grand Rapids would ask about shots, but you didn't HAVE to have them to bring a sick pet in. Just call vets and explain the situation, that you cannot find the papers but they need to be seen. Your only other option would be to get health official involved as you are sick as a result of their lack of treatment/cleaning.

As for the back twitching, all cats I've seen get it, it's like an itch and they lay down to scratch it.

[zombiequeen]

Ah, ok. I bet the reason they want the papers is in case you have pet insurance or something, when I called she said it was for the shots. It's probably the office I called, I'll admit I only called the low-income payment-plan one because of the short-notice.
Hubby said that as soon as we can he's just taking Radar into a vet's office and telling them what's going on, and he'll tell Grandma that the cat snuck out so he's going to the vet. I know she'll have to take that because every time he sneaks out, even if he doesn't do anything, he ends up vomiting for about a week.
Thanks about the twitching thing. Sal has that thick short fur so it might be he's getting too hot and then itchy, he's fat and can't lick his back so maybe that's why he gets annoyed? I'll show you guys a picture of him.

[kpzra]

Awww. He has the same fur and feet as Angus did. I used to laugh watching Angus jump and do the fish out of water when his back would twitch, until he'd just roll around. Angus had 6 toes on each paw, George his son had 8...it was freaky.

[zombiequeen]

That's awesome. I just scratched Sal's back and he stretched out as long as he could because it was itchy. I'll still ask about it when he goes to the vet, it might be arthritis/kitty obesity too. That picture makes him look thinner than he really is.
I did get the stink-eye from grandma though when I was fussing over Sal. I don't think she's happy the cats like me so much. I have a way with the kitties.
The biggest reason I'm so panicked about these two is because of what happened to my old cat Spiggit, he ended up starving/poisoned because he ate frogs and toads. I kind of feel that it's my fault if I see a cat suffering now, because I was so helpless with poor Spiggit.