You want us to clean..how?

[Kyree]

I'm not sure where this should go, so if someone feels the need to move it to a more correct topic, then feel free to do so.

As I've said before, I work in a deli inside of a grocery store. It's a big business in the MN-Wisconsin area. Recently they've made a couple changes that have me scratching my head and wondering if it's possible that the health department said okay to it.

The way we used to clean our meat and cheese slicers is this. We had a bucket of soapy water, and a bucket of sanitizer water. And towels. Our company took away our buckets, told us it wasn't "sanitary" to have them. Gave us instead a squirt bottle. One squirt bottle. Of Sanitizer. No soap. And they're taking away our towels shortly, replacing them with paper towels. So..we're basically just tossing water on the slicers and wiping them off.

My question...is there some way that the health department would seriously approve of this? They've always seemed.....well...completely anal about EVERYTHING. This doesn't seem like something they'd say okay to. Now they expect us to clean, actually not only our slicers, but our ENTIRE deli with sanitizer and paper towels.

If someone here has more insight into a Heath department role, and if this is as I think, something really wrong, is there a way I can contact them to ask?

[CanadaGirl]

In my mind, hot and soapy water should do a lot more good than "chemicals"... but who knows. :/

[Broomjockey]

I think that it's a cost saving measure, and there's no way health would like the fact that you don't have soap or buckets anymore. Also, theoretically, I thought the health department's number would be on the inspection certificate, which should either be at the deli, or customer service. Of course, I'm Canadian, so YMMV.

[BrightEyedKitty]

No 3-compartment sinks?

[PepperElf]

personally i'd say a bottle of that spray-bleach would work well... my bf bought 2, one for home and one for work. it's weak enough to use on stuff you eat off of (just rinse it off well) but has enough bleach to sanitize.

think it's some kinda lysol product.

but i think you'd prolly be able to ask teh google for "health code" and then put in your state name... might get something. I tried it for VA and got a bunch of links including who was shut down for violations etc.

[Kyree]

No 3-compartment sinks?

We do, but we can't stick a deep fryer, or a counter, or a scale, or a 20lb slicer with electricle cord in them

And the sanitizer we use is basically water. There's no bleach in it that I'm aware of. It's made to basically wipe the slicer off and re-use said slicer without washing with water. You can spray and then set meat on it.

[PepperElf]

omg. maybe i shouldn't have gone there... http://www.healthspace.ca/vdh
from there, i can pick any city in VA and what restaraunt... and then see the past few years of health inspections and violations.

not sure what's worse... that places i really liked were on the list (tho i'm thinking, does anyplace ever get through without any hits?) or that some of the places had repeat critical hits. O_o

[Bright_Star]

I always thought that when you clean a slicer that you take it apart & wash the parts in hot soapy water & then dunk the parts in a solution of sanitizer & then let it AIR DRY. Now the main part that has the electrical cord-you clean that by washing it with hot, soapy water that you've placed in a bucket & then sanitizing it by using a wash cloth saoked in sanitizing solution & then letting that AIR DRY. I used to work in a cafeteria that cleaned their slicers in the way that I just described.
Just using a bottle of whatever aint gonna cut it. Broomjockey mentioned "cost saving measures" BUT if you clean a slicer wrong & somebody gets sick from contaminated food then your savings just went down the drain.
That's a disaster waiting to happen. You never know who's watching & just waiting to pounce on you for health violations.

[CaroPhoenix]

omg. maybe i shouldn't have gone there... http://www.healthspace.ca/vdh
from there, i can pick any city in VA and what restaraunt... and then see the past few years of health inspections and violations.

OMG ... You're right! I live in Northern Virginia. There are so many restaurants that I used to go to or currently go to or a contemplating on going to with multiple critical stuff. I'll have to keep an eye on that list. *shudders*

[Geek King]

not sure what's worse... that places i really liked were on the list (tho i'm thinking, does anyplace ever get through without any hits?) or that some of the places had repeat critical hits. O_o

I don't think anyplace is going to be perfect, I would only really worry about the ones with critical failures. Especially if they were repeat offences. That means they probably are failing to do things you would do in your own home for food safety.

[digilight]

From my years of food service (many moons ago, in a city far far away) I would think that this reaks of fail. A plan thought up by a bunch of stupids in suits who wouldn't know the phrase "Cross Contamination" if it bit them in the butt.

Granted bleach will kill most germs and yuckies, will a squirt of bleachy type water really remove caked on crap from slicing processed hoofs and buttholes or whatever the meat of the day is.

I know that around here they are strict as hell about that kind of stuff and places get shut down all the time for it.

They might be correct in what they are doing, but to me it sounds wrong.

[Kyree]

OMG ... You're right! I live in Northern Virginia. There are so many restaurants that I used to go to or currently go to or a contemplating on going to with multiple critical stuff. I'll have to keep an eye on that list. *shudders*

Actually, Idrinkarum and Geek King, don't be so scared of that stuff. At my deli, leaving a clean, unused towel on the counter is a critical fail. putting a box on a counter that we use as our desk and never ever put food on is a critical fail. Having our broom on the wrong side of the rack for brooms/dustpans is a critical fail. leaving the door in our supply cabinet open (cups, forks, all in bags still) is a critical fail...etc.
I personally failed our deli when I first started because in the middle of the day, during a rush I didn't clean the crumbs under a slicer. The health inspector decided to come in right then and do an inspection.

So if you see critical fail, it could be something minor like that. For us it's always like that. Don't panic until you know what it really was.

[Rapscallion]

not sure what's worse... that places i really liked were on the list (tho i'm thinking, does anyplace ever get through without any hits?) or that some of the places had repeat critical hits. O_o

I used to have the retired regional head of the Environmental Health Office as a regular customer. He told me that if his staff went through a well-known major supermarket known for its scrupulously high standards (M&S for the Brits) and didn't find at least a half-dozen things wrong, they weren't doing their jobs right. Nobody can be perfect all the time.

What you have to look for are things that are important. A bin without a lid isn't a problem most of the time, and some places can be done for that. Spoiled meat still in the chiller is a major risk.

Rapscallion

[Seshat]

Squirting a surface with any antibacterial is going to kill the bacteria currently on the surface.

Leaving a film of antibacterial will continue to kill bacteria that arrive on the surface, but will also transfer the antibacterial substance to foodstuffs placed on the surface.

However, if you don't remove the fats, oils and greases from the surface, that have been transferred from foods, then there's a bacteria banquet right there. Even if you have a sheen of antibacterial stuff on top of the layer of fats, oils and greases, there's a bacteria party going on underneath the layer in contact with the antibacterial.

To clean a food preparation surface (other than one that's going to become intensely hot), you must remove not only the visible food detritus, but also the fatty/oily layer. Which means hot soapy water.

(It's not so important to get rid of the fatty/oily layer of a cooking surface, when the cooking surface is going to get up to bacteria-killing temperatures: this is why cast iron frypans or barbeque tops can get away with not having the soapy-water cleaning.)

[CaroPhoenix]

Kyree - Whew. I was worried there for a minute but you have eased my worries a bit. I do know that sometimes, the criticals are for more serious stuff (like using out-of-date food or whatever). Thanks for the inside info.