IDing everyone in the group?

[Titi]

But if one twin was legal wouldn't that mean the other twin was legal as well?

It doesn't matter if they are legal. The fact that one had an ID and the other didn't means a third party sale which is illegal in the state. It is the same as going out to the car and trying to get your friend who is also legal to buy because you left your license at home I still can't do it by law. But the sting used twins in the same clothes just one had a cap on and the other didn't. I had customers before then that would come in wearing a cap and when they went to get their ID they would take it off so that they could see in the car. Some put them back on but many didn't.

[KiaKat]

We just had a round of stings here. One of the bars that got caught was (allegedly) hit by a pair passing themselves off as parent/child to the assistant bartender, with the "parent" vouching for (possibly buying for?) the "child." The head bartender claims she wouldn't have carded the kid either, because he looked to be on the right side of 21, and they're a higher-end bar.

The whole thing reeks. It's my favourite bar, with lots of odd liquors and high-end creative cocktails.

[greek_jester]

That kind of thing to me ranks up with the rubbish about needing to have a passport valid for X months after you leave a country.

The passport thing actually makes sense to me; what if the holder is arrested on trumped up charges and released weeks or months later after intervention from the local embassy? What if another volcano explodes in Iceland and everyone has to get a boat home? Easier to make sure there's some wiggle room in the passports to be on the safe side.

[Titi]

If it was due to expire that same day, that is complete rubbish. Unless a license has an explicit TIME of expiry listed on it, it should technically expire at 11:59:59pm of that day, meaning if someone goes in today at 8pm with a drivers license that is due to expire today, it would be perfectly valid. That kind of thing to me ranks up with the rubbish about needing to have a passport valid for X months after you leave a country.

Also the second description reeks of entrapment to me, using identical twins as part of a sting operation, sounds like it was a quiet week and they were desperate to bust someone, no matter how iffy the means.

On the first story that was when we learned that it expires as soon as it hits 12AM on that day. No one knew that. You would think that you would have that day. It is the same way in the state that I live in now. A girl came in to buy alcohol on her 21st birthday and the ID was expired on her birthday. The state doesn't allow alcohol sales after 11:45 (yeah, it's weird). But I wished her a happy birthday, scanned her ID and was told that it was expired. Luckily for me a regular police officer was in the store and explained that while they will let it go for minor traffic offences but that if I took the ID he would have to arrest me and he didn't want the paperwork.

She came back the next day with her temp ID (which in this state although on paper has all necessary info).

[Irving Patrick Freleigh]

If it was due to expire that same day, that is complete rubbish. Unless a license has an explicit TIME of expiry listed on it, it should technically expire at 11:59:59pm of that day, meaning if someone goes in today at 8pm with a drivers license that is due to expire today, it would be perfectly valid. That kind of thing to me ranks up with the rubbish about needing to have a passport valid for X months after you leave a country.

Also the second description reeks of entrapment to me, using identical twins as part of a sting operation, sounds like it was a quiet week and they were desperate to bust someone, no matter how iffy the means.

State and local governments are just as hard up for money as you and I, and love making examples of people who do the wrong thing, even inadvertently.

I'm picturing the jailhouse scene had Titi gotten caught up in that sting:

"What are you in for?"
"Sexual assault."
"What are you in for?"
"Armed robbery."
"What are you in for?"
"I sold alcohol to somebody with an expired ID."
everybody gasps and backs away.

[BPFH]

Paging Mr. Guthrie...

"What are you in for?"
"I sold alcohol to somebody with an expired ID."
everybody gasps and backs away.

"...till I said, 'And creating a nuisance.' And they all came back, shook my hand, and we had a great time..."

[Sapphire Silk]

As a bit of an aside, what's so funny about this to me is I was regularly going into Rite Aid by myself when I was 7 or 8 years old and buying cigs for my mom with no questions asked.

That was almost 30 years ago.

I don't know what kinds of laws were on the books then.

30 years ago it probably wasn't illegal to buy cigarettes if you were under 18. And if it was, the penalties weren't as severe.

Funny, my parents never asked me to buy cigarettes for them when I was a kid. Maybe they didn't want me getting any ideas; they didn't even like buying us that cigarette candy they had back then. Fortunately, Mom didn't actually smoke much (1/2 pack a day most days). It was Dad who was a chain smoker, and he had access at work if he ran out (back then he could smoke in his office).

Also the second description reeks of entrapment to me, using identical twins as part of a sting operation, sounds like it was a quiet week and they were desperate to bust someone, no matter how iffy the means.

Yeah, me too. Even if it was technically within the bounds of the law, it's not within the spirit. I think a judge would take a dim view of it, and a defense attorney could beat it in court. But most people would take a plea just to get it over with since it usually involves a fine and not jail time, which is probably why they get away with it.

I'm glad I never worked in a place that sold cigarettes

[Mystic]

Back when I use to sell alcohol at the convenience store in slumsville next to the government housing, I use to not only ID the person buying, but if I saw people in their car outside of the shop, I made them bring them in and ID'd them as well. Why? Because about 90% of the time, it was underage people in the car and the alcohol was being bought for them as well.

[DGoddessChardonnay]

30 years ago it probably wasn't illegal to buy cigarettes if you were under 18. And if it was, the penalties weren't as severe.

Funny, my parents never asked me to buy cigarettes for them when I was a kid. Maybe they didn't want me getting any ideas; they didn't even like buying us that cigarette candy they had back then. Fortunately, Mom didn't actually smoke much (1/2 pack a day most days). It was Dad who was a chain smoker, and he had access at work if he ran out (back then he could smoke in his office).

I don't think it was a big deal back 30 years ago concerning cigarette sales. I recall walking into a convenience store when I was 15 and buying my own smokes. Nobody carded me and nobody cared - if I had the cash, I could have my smokes.

And I did this on occasion - most of the time, Mom would pick a carton at the grocery store when she did the shopping. She'd double check and ask what brand. Especially if I was going to spend the weekend with Dad and Stepmom - I'd make sure I had my smokes for the weekend before I left my house, as my Stepmom wanted to complain about the fact that I smoked. She thought if I was old enough to smoke, I was old enough to have a job.

I had a job, thanks. It was called "taking care of the house for Mom so SHE could work full time" in addition to going to school full time. Mom told her point blank not to worry about it - she'd see to it I had what I needed for the weekend.

Typical life at my house in the 1980's.

[Cia]

In some states this is legal. Aha, link to map of exceptions. My parents would let me have a sip of whatever they were having (and it's legal in my state) but I hardly ever liked it.

Huh, according to my Aunt you can't even give your kid a sip of alcohol in Montana. Either the law changed or she's mistaken.

One of the local grocery stores failed the underage sting badly. It was the talk of all the other stores in the chain.

[notalwaysright]

On a side note, just a few minutes north across the border, the drinking age is 19. I wonder how that works? If a 19-20 year old US citizen shows ID, do they get denied?

[NecessaryCatharsis]

Not in Ontario, as long as I could read your id, you were 19, I would serve you alcohol. 18 year old ontarians go to Montreal for the same reason (also Montreal is a really fun place).

[Jetfire]

But you would need to drink it over in Canada. If you try to bring it back to the States, possession laws would take effect and you would need to dispose of them.