Overheard at MickyD's

[Aethian]

Mom was in the local library one day with this group of girls sitting across from her. One was over weight and looking a lot like a couple year younger and pink haired version of me. (At least thats what she said....I would never die my hair pink...maybe blue tho...) Anyhoo seems pink hair just got recently diagnosed and is enrolled in learning classe and all that. Well before she was able to go to them she decided to look up things online with her girlfriends present.

Mom said that two of the girls ewwed and irked at some of the pictures they must have found and the third bywatcher called her Mom on her cell and asked if she could get tested and if she could have her gym membership back. All four were a bit large and two of them had that 'round' face that one sometimes sees in those with high sugars.

[chainedbarista]

she's a darwinian award in the making; as for the comment about women and weight, yes, it can be hard, but you actually have to TRY to do something about it.

as for the 'dietary practices' of this particular rocket scientist, no comment.

[Becks]

Where's a Clue-by-four when you need one?!

Mine is still packed away somewhere. Maybe in a closet. Hmmmmmmmmmm.

[One-Fang]

such a simple change, and my weight is still going down nice and steadily.

That's all it takes. Simple changes. If you aren't already enjoying walking to work and being soda-free, you will, and then you'll find other simple changes to make.

McD's girl doesn't have to even give up McD's entirely. Certainly not right away. Little changes eventually add up to big results. If only people wouldn't look at the whole big problem ("I'm 300 lbs - how am I EVER going to lose that extra 180lbs?!") and instead just look for little changes like that.

(250 down to 170 here).

[DeltaSierra]

I know what you mean, patiokitty. When I was originally diagnosed, it entailed cutting out my caffeine intake to nil, and I also stopped drinking alcohol. I'm a member of the Ladies Auxillary to the Royal Canadian Legion, and we have a bar where I have occasionally bartended as a volunteer. There are 3 or 4 regulars there who like to sit all day and moan and b*tch about their diabetes and how awful it makes their lives while doing nothing but drinking beer and wine coolers all day long. I REALLY could use that clue-by-four that was mentioned earlier on these people.

[Seshat]

This is a class of people honed in to health, exercising, being fit. They couldn't comprehend the mentality of "I'd rather take some pills to sustain me for a little while and die horribly". I get it. People really are that lazy. They really are that resistant to change. "Exercise" and "diet" really are THAT much worse for them than a horrible death.

Which is to say, I understand THAT people choose that. I don't necessarily understand WHY.

I can partially explain it.

I'm insulin resistant, aka pre-diabetic. This is partly genetic, and partly a result of the PCOS. So I know what it feels like to have insulin problems (though not full-blown diabetes) and try to change your diet.


A diabetic/insulin resistant person has blood sugar which seesaws violently unless externally controlled. The most obvious way to control it, and one which is easiest to develop independently, is to take frequent small sugar doses.
In other words, to keep a can of soda or a bag of lollies next to you, and take a sip or eat a lolly (candy? sweet?) every five to fifteen minutes.

This keeps your blood sugar kind of even. Rocky-even, but enough to keep you functional.

Take the candy or soda away from a person who's doing this, without replacing it with a proper low-glycaemic-index diet, and they feel AWFUL. Absolutely rotten, and effectively non-functional. Their blood sugar spikes after a meal, then within half an hour they're sluggish, they can't think, they can't focus, and their body is telling them they're starving.
And a single glass of Coke will make them feel good again.

Even converting to a low-glycaemic-index diet, under controlled circumstances, knowing what you're doing, feels ghastly. I've done it several times, because the temptation to 'just have a small glass of soda, it can't hurt' is so strong.

A low GI diet works, and keeps you functional, but it feels very, very different to the lots-of-small-hits-of-sugar diet. And any time you forget to eat on time in a low GI diet, you know that peanut paste sandwich on multigrain bread will take at least ten minutes to kick in, but a small glass of soda or a couple of lollies would make you feel good almost instantly.

It takes a lot of willpower to keep to the proper diet. I can only do it with a bag of nuts or seeds kept close at hand at all times.

I can also only do it now that I've found foods that count as good AND satiate me - like dahl, or vietnamese rice paper rolls with a lean meat inside.



As for the exercise: that feeling of new muscle developing, that's kind of pain and kind of not? To me, at least, that's painful. Okay, I have a pain disorder, so that doesn't necessarily correlate to everyone.

But it IS a strange feeling to someone who's not used to it. On top of that, there's the fact that the novice is probably overextending themselves anyway and thus getting 'real' pain. Plus they don't know how to avoid chafing or blisters.

Plus there's probably no sweat-wicking clothing available in their size anywhere (except PERHAPS specialist shops that you athletes know about but we don't), and they may not have ever heard of sweat-wicking clothing anyway.

So exercise means pain, blisters, chafing, unpleasant sweating, probably fungal infections in the folds of their skin (they also probably don't know about the truly effective antiperspirants, only the supermarket ones), and no pleasant results that they can ever detect.

Noone ever teaches these people about proper effective blister preventions, or sweat-wicking clothing, or the truly effective antiperspirants, or effective anti-chafing and anti-fungal treatments. The only reason - ONLY reason - I ever learned about them was a friend who was into athletic things, and was horrified that I didn't know.


So to you, the choice is serious medical problems, or fun exercise and yummy foods like Vietnamese rice paper rolls, dahl and saffron rice, and tofu or lean meat stir fries.

To them, the choice is serious medical problems, or serious medical problems aggravated by a life of torture where they're denied the only foods they've found that make them feel anything near 'okay'.

It's not laziness. Okay, it's not necessarily laziness. It's actually a sensible quality-of-life decision when you really learn about it from their point of view.


I hope this explains it, and that you - and everyone else who wants to help people get past a diabetes type diagnosis - find this helpful.

[JustADude]

Even converting to a low-glycaemic-index diet, under controlled circumstances, knowing what you're doing, feels ghastly. I've done it several times, because the temptation to 'just have a small glass of soda, it can't hurt' is so strong.

That made me go "Woah, hold on a sec!!!" for a minute until I evaluated my eating habits and realized that I'm not Insulin Resistant, I'm just addicted to caffeine.

Still not good, but it's a cheap, legal habit with easy access to my fix.

[Chromatix]

I can't imagine living a life without any form of exercise. And I'm a computer programmer, one of the most sedentary professions there is.

Wherever I've lived, there has either been a supermarket within easy walking distance (as now), or a supermarket in easy cycling distance and a corner-shop in easy walking distance. Since I can walk to the nearest shop several times a week, and carry quite a lot of stuff on my bike (with Tardis panniers), I simply don't need a car.

For bigger loads, I have a flat-bed trailer for my bike that will carry up to 45kg (about 100lb). I could easily swap this for a child-seat trailer if I wanted.

And then I cycle a bit for fun. When it isn't raining, that is. A properly-maintained bike will let you cycle a long way on level-ish paths with very little effort - yet that little effort, sustained over an hour or two, is enough to keep fit. The increasing abundance of cycle paths in Europe helps a lot.

So I exercise enough that, more or less whatever I choose to eat, I would never get seriously unhealthy. I try to eat vaguely healthy things and amounts anyway. So I'm normal weight, normal shape, and while I have no abs (which just shows that cycling is my main form of exercise), the rest of my body is fairly strong.

The fact that so many Americans (and, I admit, even a number of Europeans) manifestly fail to achieve this... is rather depressing, actually.

[One-Fang]

I hope this explains it, and that you - and everyone else who wants to help people get past a diabetes type diagnosis - find this helpful.

Thanks Seshat.

I wonder if there's a difference though between the experience you describe (trying to eat well, difficulty in recognising benefits, almost 'accidentally' finding out that perceived limitations weren't actually so limiting) and the "I really don't want to give up three cheeseburgers a meal" approach that seems to be the case in the OP...?

It's probably one of those situations where we're getting dangerously close to grey territory.

Can we agree that those who don't even attempt to investigate what a healthy lifestyle would or could mean for them, and immediately choose the drugs instead, because they don't even want to try, are those we're 'targetting' in this thread?

[Can I Help Your A$$?]

Oh, man. She's not going to be "lazy" long, after having diabetes awhile.

Your kidneys get damaged.

You can be sick to your stomach ALL THE TIME.

You can have chronic diarreah.

You can get terrible pains in your back (kidneys) and legs.

You can lose your feet.

You can lose your sight.

You stop being able to sleep.

When you are a "good" fat lazy diabetic, like me, you can look forward to only some of those symptoms.

Remember that being "fat and lazy" is only part of it. The other part is being in a family that consists of all diabetics, and no matter how "good" and acceptible and spartan and productive member of society you are, you still have pockets of fat in your body that can only be removed by surgery, pockets that store sugar. This sugar is still there, still making you miserable, even if you abstain from eating all white foods, and exercise your little heart out.

But of course people still look at you if you dare to eat outside of your house and think you're a pig.

[Seshat]

Can we agree that those who don't even attempt to investigate what a healthy lifestyle would or could mean for them, and immediately choose the drugs instead, because they don't even want to try, are those we're 'targetting' in this thread?

I took no offence!

People like you and Chromatix never developed this state in the first place, so it's as alien an experience to you as any human experience can be.

Me, I was very active as a child and teenager, in a tree-climbing, dancing-in-your-living-room, bike-and-public-transport sort of way.

I gradually became less and less active, slowly, as illness and the occasional injury made activity painful and difficult. I also never learned effective treatments for chafing and blistering, so as illness and weight gain made me more susceptible to them, I had another disincentive to exercise.

I'm sure there are plenty of people in my situation - and even more who never had that tree-climbing, dancing-in-your-living room type of lifestyle.

The purpose of my post was simply to give you, hopefully your fellow students, and others who are in a position to help these people, the perspective you'll need to have to actually make lasting changes in their lives.

As for me, I have a helper who knows effective blister treatments now.

[One-Fang]

Oh I've been in the "fat and can't exercise" camp. I used to weigh 250lbs and was never (ever!) an exerciser. Lazy, slobby, and totally at fault for my own weight and size through my lifestyle choices.

Perhaps luckily, I never had much of a problem with chafing and blistering when I did start though.