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It is called Do It Yourself for a reason

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  • It is called Do It Yourself for a reason

    I used to work with an attorney who was one of the editors of a self-help book for doing your own divorce. We had to keep a phone line dedicated just for assisting people who were using that book.

    I cannot count how many questions we answered by simply opening up a copy of the book and reading the sentence with the answer in it to the person. Most of the time, the person would state that s/he had not read the book (it is really short and simple to read) and just wanted to fill out the forms and "file the stuff", so s/he wanted us to walk her/him through it on the phone. These types got really upset when we told them the book was designed for THEM to do that work and if they wanted someone to do it for them, they should hire an attorney.

    One of the first instructions in the book regarding the forms was that the person needed to type the forms out rather than using the pages in the book, as the forms often had multiple paragraphs of options for what should be plead and the same options for what should be in the decree (like a paragraph stating there were no children by the marriage followed by one stating there were minor children followed by one stating all the children had reached the age of majority - choose one). The instructions also stated that the book's pages were printed on both sides, and Texas courts do not accept things for filing that are printed on front and back. At least three times a month someone would call to complain that the forms were useless since the person had just ripped them out of the book and tried to file them.

    We did offer people a service of checking to see if they had filled out their forms properly. For us to do this, however, the person needed to fill out the forms as s/he thought they should be and then send them to us. So many people sent us blank forms ripped out of the book along with some information about themselves and their spouses and wanted us to create the document for them. We usually sent them a request for the attorney’s full retainer as a response.
    "Ignorance is no excuse for a law."
    .................................................. ..................- Alfred E. Newman

  • #2
    Quoth South Texan View Post
    I used to work with an attorney who was one of the editors of a self-help book for doing your own divorce.
    That's awesome. Coming soon to a town near you: divorce drive-thru.

    I'm not surprised by the rest though. People can't be bothered to THINK for themselves anymore. Never mind reading it first. Because if they read it that means they have to attempt to comprehend what they are reading. And if they don't understand something they'll just have to ask you anyway. So why not just have you do their "do it yourself" stuff anyway?

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    • #3
      We sell those 'do-it-yourself' legal forms and books... for selling property, divorces, will kits, etc.

      Once in a while I get a customer who wants me to answer very specific questions about the books... "Will this help me if <fill in the blank>?", which I can't answer because I've never had to use them.

      When thay ask me "Why don't you know about all of this?", the only answer I have is "If I knew that, I'd wouldn't be working here as a copy jockey, I'd be a lawyer."

      That seems to end the conversation.
      "Kamala the Ugandan Giant" 1950-2020 • "Bullet" Bob Armstrong 1939-2020 • "Road Warrior Animal" 1960-2020 • "Zeus" Tiny Lister Jr. 1958-2020 • "Hacksaw" Butch Reed 1954-2021 • "New Jack" Jerome Young 1963-2021 • "Mr. Wonderful" Paul Orndorff 1949-2021 • "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton 1958-2021 • Daffney 1975-2021

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      • #4
        Well, why don't they just ask their partner to fill it out for them??


        When I said "From my research", what I actually meant to say was "Made shit up" - from a thottbot thread

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        • #5
          If they asked you a question and you answered it, isn't that giving legal advice without having passed the bar exam or paying bar dues and therefore illegal?

          If legal stuff was so easy, people wouldn't have to go to school for 6 years to get paid large amounts to do it for you
          !
          "For truth is always strange; stranger than fiction." -- Lord Byron

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          • #6
            Hey South Texan, I think I used that book to do my first divorce. It was easy to understand, made plenty of sense, and the only part I had trouble with was hiding it from my soon-to-be-ex.
            Thanks for the book!

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            • #7
              I used to play Warhammer 40,000 and one time when I was buying something, I overheard this phone call...

              *phone rings*
              CSR: "Hello, Games Workshop... no look I told you before, you'll have to read the book that came in the starter kit. That's got all the rules. No you can't keep phoning us to get us to explain things. Read the book."

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              • #8
                Quoth jjllbb View Post
                That's awesome. Coming soon to a town near you: divorce drive-thru.

                I'm not surprised by the rest though. People can't be bothered to THINK for themselves anymore. Never mind reading it first. Because if they read it that means they have to attempt to comprehend what they are reading. And if they don't understand something they'll just have to ask you anyway. So why not just have you do their "do it yourself" stuff anyway?

                It really isn't as hard to do as you would think. I helped my Mom with her last one. (snicker all ya like, she promised she is done with it all) I typed all of the forms she would need for the entire process so all she would have to do is file them with the court at the appropriate times. It helps if you don't have any minor children or property disagreements.
                Tamezin

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                • #9
                  The instructions also stated that the book's pages were printed on both sides, and Texas courts do not accept things for filing that are printed on front and back. At least three times a month someone would call to complain that the forms were useless since the person had just ripped them out of the book and tried to file them.
                  At the library, we have those books. And they are very very very very popular. Luckily no one came back to us and complain "but the court said I can't fill out this form/they won't take this copy/etc"

                  There is also, through our website and maybe any library website, access to Gale Legal forms, which are the form you can download and print/save.

                  I can tell stories and stories about calling about legal advice, wanting us to read Black Law Dictionary, and wanting us to tell them which form to fill out. Ugh.
                  Time! Time! Time is what turns kittens into cats.

                  Don't teach me a lesson; all I learn is that you are an asshole.

                  I wish porn had subtitles.

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                  • #10
                    Quoth jjllbb View Post
                    Coming soon to a town near you: divorce drive-thru.
                    Divorce drive-bys?
                    Bark like a chicken!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Quoth Skeksin View Post
                      Divorce drive-bys?
                      Speed bump:
                      rrrmmmrrrmmm thump thump rrrmmmrrrmmm

                      Ex:
                      rrrmmmrrrmmm thump thump SCREEECH!
                      Vrooom Vrooom thump thump SCREEECH!
                      Vrooom Vrooom thump thump SCREEECH!

                      Lather, Rinse. Repeat until satisfied.
                      I am not an a**hole. I am a hemorrhoid. I irritate a**holes!
                      Procrastination: Forward planning to insure there is something to do tomorrow.
                      Derails threads faster than a pocket nuke.

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                      • #12
                        Quoth edible_hat View Post
                        I used to play Warhammer 40,000 and one time when I was buying something, I overheard this phone call...

                        *phone rings*
                        CSR: "Hello, Games Workshop... no look I told you before, you'll have to read the book that came in the starter kit. That's got all the rules. No you can't keep phoning us to get us to explain things. Read the book."
                        There's one of those in every gaming group I've been in.

                        "I haven't read the rules so I'll pick the most complicated character\army in the book, then plead for help every time I need to use the flangy rules"
                        Lady, people aren't chocolates. D'you know what they are mostly? Bastards. Bastard-coated bastards with bastard filling. Dr Cox - Scrubs

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                        • #13
                          Quoth El Pollo Guerrera View Post
                          We sell those 'do-it-yourself' legal forms and books... for selling property, divorces, will kits, etc.
                          Yeah myself an my first husband bought one of those-the clerk rang us up and told us to have a nice day.

                          My response:
                          "urm, not very likely"
                          clerk finally actually looking at what we bought I'm sorry
                          Me and the now ex:
                          Honestly.... the image of that in my head made me go "AWESOME!"..... and then I remembered I am terribly strange.-Red dazes

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                          • #14
                            Quoth Slytovhand View Post
                            Well, why don't they just ask their partner to fill it out for them??


                            Good one!!!
                            I'm trying to see things from your point of view, but I can't get my head that far up my keister!

                            Who is John Galt?
                            -Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged

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