Would you care to PAY for that?

[Dave1982]

This started off as another "But I only need oooooooooneeeeeee" story, but became more than that....

Guy walks in holding a very small plastic zip tie and asks if we sell larger ones. We actually do, in the computer cable aisle (along with a number of other items for "cable management").

Me: Right this way, sir.

SC: I only need one.

Me: Well, this is what I have (hands him the pack of 100 for $8.98. That's expensive, I know). Is there anything else you need?

SC: No, that'll be all.

Now, something about this guy just rubbed me the wrong way, and I figured he was going to slit the package and just take what he wanted. I tried to keep an eye on him, but since the Christmas season is now in full swing, it wasn't long before I was pulled away to help someone else.

The SECOND I was able to turn my attention back to him, I saw he was taking a roundabout path to the exit. I went back to the cable aisle, and sure enough the package I'd handed him was back on the shelf.....opened.

Thinking he was long gone at this point, I went back to work, but a couple minutes later I was told to go help a customer at the UPS counter.

Same guy!!! He'd used two STOLEN zip ties as "seals" on a USMC "duffel bag" (though it was cube shaped, and not a traditional duffel), which he now wanted to ship out - to himself - in Texas.

Now, here's what irritates the shit out of me:

1) He wanted 2nd day air, and the bag weighed about 40 pounds. This put the base shipping rate at about $107.

2) He wanted to insure it for $500, which added $12.50 to the rate.

3) He did NOT want the bag put into a box. UPS will take large, unboxed items, but since they require special handling, that requires an $8 "additional handling" charge. He was fine with that.

So, he was willing to pay $125+ to ship this damn thing, but was too fucking cheap to not pay for those zip ties? And the hell of it was the fact that those zip ties weren't even holding anything; he was using them as anti-tamper seals. If he had asked, I could have put some tamper-evident tape there (which we have at the shipping counter) rather than him resorting to stealing stuff to do so.

And on top of all that is the fact that I am powerless to do anything about this. And when I was finally able to report this to management (and i had all the guys info) they of course felt it wasn't worth the hassle over two zip ties. I can understand that, but I still find this to be aggravating to no end.

[nickj6282]

Call my cynical, but I would have grabbed that pack of zip ties and rang that through along with all his postage.

[El Pollo Guerrera]

And on top of all that is the fact that I am powerless to do anything about this. And when I was finally able to report this to management (and i had all the guys info) they of course felt it wasn't worth the hassle over two zip ties. I can understand that, but I still find this to be aggravating to no end.

They shouldn't be thinking about it as "two zip ties".

They should be thinking about it as "a pack of 100 zip ties that they will lose money on because it's been opened and pieces taken from."

[Mnemjian]

So it's basically okay to shoplift as long as the item isn't worth that much money? Hmm I always thought that stealing was stealing. Didn't know there was a minimum

[karma_gypsy]

And zip ties are always something that you'll need on rare occasion ... so now he's figured out that whenever he needs one, he'll just go to the store and get one out of the packaging ... It's petty and menial, but theft is still theft ... and someone is left footing the bill, whether it's the store or the next customer who purchases the products (what if they were doing a project and they needed exactly 100 zip ties?).

[Titi]

Call my cynical, but I would have grabbed that pack of zip ties and rang that through along with all his postage.

that is exactly what I would have done as well. He couldn't say anything at that point or he would have proved that he stole them.

[Dave1982]

Except that that would be "bad customer service." Don't forget that this is the same manager who told me I was wrong to challenge a customer who changed his kid on boxes of live product.

[bainsidhe]

That's when being polite is in your favor. "Oh, I'm so glad you're still here! You accidentally dropped the zip ties after you opened them. Don't worry though, we set them aside for you and I'll have someone run and get them. Any other packing supplies I can ring up for you?"

Thief: Buh...wha? Are you accusing me of stealing?!!! Rabble Rabble Rant.

Dave: *Looks pointedly at zip ties on bag* "Oh of course not, sir! And I'm sure our cameras will show you just opened the bag for a closer look through the transparent packaging. But I'm afraid we have to charge for the opened package" *And Dave gives his sad face "Your new total is $XYZ."

[Ironclad Alibi]

Since he didn't pay for the zip ties, they weren't his. After he paid for the bag to be shipped, and you had moved it to a place away from him, you could have clipped and removed the zip ties while he looked on, and sent the bag on its merry way.

[MrsEclipse]

This is the epitome of suck.

He spoils a product and shoplift instead of paying for a thing that you always need more of anyway and used it for a service he could have gotten free anyway after showing you he could afford it to buy the damn thing in the first place.

It's like a black hole of suck. I mean, I know that's what black holes do, but still! It's like a mobius suck.

[Jester]

So it's basically okay to shoplift as long as the item isn't worth that much money? Hmm I always thought that stealing was stealing. Didn't know there was a minimum

Actually, there is a difference.

For instance, let's say I, in a moment of drunken idiocy, go to my local convenience store and walk out with a twelve pack of my favorite suds without paying. I will be charged with a misdemeanor.

Let's say a manipulative deceptive user con artist (not that I know one) embezzles several grand from their employer. They get charge with a felony of a lower degree and get several years probation and some fines.

Moving up the ladder, if the wife of the school superintendent uses fraudulent means to steal several hundred thousand dollars of school and student funds for personal gain (this actually happened here recently), she will be charged with a higher degree felony and will be looking at many years in the clink. (Last I heard, she's looking at up to 80 years.)

And at the top of the ladder, we have your friend and mine, Mr. Bernie Madoff, who made off with $65 billion dollars of people's money by basically lying to them and ripping them off. It is pretty damn unlikely he will ever see freedom again in his lifetime.

So yes, there is a difference in what you steal. Stealing is stealing, but there are different degrees.

[Broomjockey]

So yes, there is a difference in what you steal. Stealing is stealing, but there are different degrees.

Actually, that would be (I believe the American terms are...) "Petty Theft," "Grand Theft," "Petty Larceny," and "Grand Larceny." There aren't degrees of stealing. There are degrees of theft and larceny.

[Mnemjian]

Actually, there is a difference.

Yes, of course, I guess I should have specified that I meant when stealing from a copy shop. I think that managers should care if a person is stealing from their store whether it's a dollar's worth of merch, or a hundred.

[Jester]

Actually, that would be (I believe the American terms are...) "Petty Theft," "Grand Theft," "Petty Larceny," and "Grand Larceny." There aren't degrees of stealing. There are degrees of theft and larceny.

Theft and larceny (as well as burglary and robbery) are forms of stealing, but they are still stealing.

And the legal terms for the examples I cited vary from State to State, sometimes from county to county.

For example, in my above examples, the embezzler was charged with "larceny" in (I think) the third degree. Whereas the superintendent's wife was charged with fraud/swindling and grand larceny in the 1st degree. (She did a few bad things, you see.) Of course, since different sites online (the court site, the sheriff's site) list the same crimes for the same people with different names or abbreviations, it's hard even to say that that is definitive.

[mattm04]

We went after some who stole a $0.65 doughnut. They ran out the door and ran straight in to a cop who was investigating a theft at the store next door. They paid and got trespassed I believe.