New DSL serice

[Blue Dragon]

A while ago I used to work for Verizon DSL doing tech support. I left the company almost 2 years ago. Here is one story of a special id-10-t error I got one day.

I don't remember what was said exactly but this is what happened.

Customer calls tech support and tells me that they just ordered DSL service and they received the DSL equipment. Everything was in the box except one item. Then the ever-so-smart customer asks me this:

"Where's the computer?"

I ended up explaining to Ms. Idiot that she needs to buy one at the computer store and ended up sending Ms. Idiot to the retention department.

It was so bad that my old trainer asked me if he could use that as an example in his training classes. I told him that he can and it ended up becoming legendary there after that.

[mattm04]

I'm sure Ms. Idiot blamed someone other than her for not reading the "computer required" fine print.

[PepperElf]

did she actually demand you supply the computer?

[Blue Dragon]

did she actually demand you supply the computer?

Yes Ms. Idiot did.

[MrSmiley]

I can't help but wonder if this is one of the reasons why my cable box (actually it's a TV-over-DSL but people don't understand what I mean unless I call it a cable box :P) allows me to surf the internet with the remote control; slowly and painfully and with MANY sites that don't render properly.

[xaenon]

Yes Ms. Idiot did.

In defense of the customer:

A few years ago, many of the larger Internet providers offered some deal where
you would get a computer with your Internet service, provided you signed on for a certain period of time - I think it was a minimum of two years, and it was a higher-than-usual rate for the service. The IP would provide a minimal machine - Win98 or WinME, 32 megs of memory, usually an Intel Celeron or Cyrix chip (a few had that awful MediaGX processor), integrated EVERYTHING, smallish hard drives, many didn't have optical drives at all, or if they did, it was a simple CD-ROM. In fact, I think that's how eMachines got started.

I don't know of any IPs that still do this sort of thing, but it may be that the customer thought it was one of those deals.

[sld72382]

In defense of the customer:

A few years ago, many of the larger Internet providers offered some deal where
you would get a computer with your Internet service, provided you signed on for a certain period of time - I think it was a minimum of two years, and it was a higher-than-usual rate for the service. The IP would provide a minimal machine - Win98 or WinME, 32 megs of memory, usually an Intel Celeron or Cyrix chip (a few had that awful MediaGX processor), integrated EVERYTHING, smallish hard drives, many didn't have optical drives at all, or if they did, it was a simple CD-ROM. In fact, I think that's how eMachines got started.

I don't know of any IPs that still do this sort of thing, but it may be that the customer thought it was one of those deals.

I don't know if any of you remember them, but there was a company called "Free PC" back in '99 that let you have a computer for free as long as you displayed their banner ads on the side of the screen. I was one of the lucky ones who got one. It had an AMD K6-2 375mhz with 64mb of memory and a 4GB hard drive. Not much, but you can't argue with free.

Only catch was that if you deleted the ads, you had to either give the computer back or pay the price for the machine. Then a few months later they went bankrupt and sent a letter saying that the computer was mine to keep and I am free to delete the ads.

[MadMike]

Only catch was that if you deleted the ads, you had to either give the computer back or pay the price for the machine. Then a few months later they went bankrupt and sent a letter saying that the computer was mine to keep and I am free to delete the ads.

Just out of curiosity, how did they know if someone deleted the ads?

[xaenon]

Just out of curiosity, how did they know if someone deleted the ads?

Well, I don't know for sure how they did it,, but if I was the company that provided the PCs, this is how I'd set it up....

I would install TWO pieces of software on the computer. The first would be the ad program itself, which would probably hook into the web browser, and would appear in the ad/remove programs control panel like any other Windows application. If a user wanted to delete the ads, he/she could just remove it with the add/remove dialog.

The second program would be 'watchware' - this would be the program that actually monitors what web sites you visit, what ads you click on, etc - as well as whether the advertising software was running or not, and it would report this information back to its bosses. This program would NOT appear in the ad/remove programs dialog, nor in the MSCONFIG tool. It would be located in a hidden folder, probably within the Windows folder itself, and would be loaded/run from registry. Thus, it would be invisible to most users. For all practical purposes, one could consider it spyware.

Now, of course, anyone reasonably competent with Windows could probably defeat this setup, but most people wouldn't know how. Witness the issues the average user has with spyware and viruses today, because the don't know to stay away from the 'off-color' sites or to NOT click on the pretty blinking icon on the web site they visit, or to NOT open strange e-mails.

Heck, even a complete scorched-earth O/S reset could bypass my setup - but most people wouldn't go that far. From what I remember of Free PC, there was a fairly comprehensive questionnaire you had to complete and submit, and then THEY would decide if you got a free computer or not. I imagine they would determine from the questionnaire whether or not you were a novice or advanced computer user. Advanced users would probably NOT be approved.

I'm sure there are other, equally valid approaches. That's just the one I thought of off-hand.

[Eric the Grey]

Just out of curiosity, how did they know if someone deleted the ads?

My understanding was that said PC's would contact the company server to update their ads on a regular basis.

Personally, I would have simply installed a second hard drive, and installed Linux or an alternate copy of XP, as a dual-boot, only booting into the ad-infested windows for when I'm not really using it, and let them think I'm doing so...

Then again, I'm not your average windows user. Most people wouldn't think of that...



Eric the Grey

[sld72382]

Well, I don't know for sure how they did it,, but if I was the company that provided the PCs, this is how I'd set it up....

I would install TWO pieces of software on the computer. The first would be the ad program itself, which would probably hook into the web browser, and would appear in the ad/remove programs control panel like any other Windows application. If a user wanted to delete the ads, he/she could just remove it with the add/remove dialog.

The second program would be 'watchware' - this would be the program that actually monitors what web sites you visit, what ads you click on, etc - as well as whether the advertising software was running or not, and it would report this information back to its bosses. This program would NOT appear in the ad/remove programs dialog, nor in the MSCONFIG tool. It would be located in a hidden folder, probably within the Windows folder itself, and would be loaded/run from registry. Thus, it would be invisible to most users. For all practical purposes, one could consider it spyware.

Now, of course, anyone reasonably competent with Windows could probably defeat this setup, but most people wouldn't know how. Witness the issues the average user has with spyware and viruses today, because the don't know to stay away from the 'off-color' sites or to NOT click on the pretty blinking icon on the web site they visit, or to NOT open strange e-mails.

Heck, even a complete scorched-earth O/S reset could bypass my setup - but most people wouldn't go that far. From what I remember of Free PC, there was a fairly comprehensive questionnaire you had to complete and submit, and then THEY would decide if you got a free computer or not. I imagine they would determine from the questionnaire whether or not you were a novice or advanced computer user. Advanced users would probably NOT be approved.

I'm sure there are other, equally valid approaches. That's just the one I thought of off-hand.

Their ad banner program was NOT in add/remove and neither was the watchware program that informed them of someone deleting the ads. The ads were constantly updated with new stuff and when it was updated that's when the watchware program would do its work.

As far as I know back then I was a novice myself LOL so that's probably why I got one, advanced users probably weren't interested in the program anyway as the machine given out was low-end (but to someone who never had a computer before it was great).

BTW, the reason they gave for merging with Emachines and the real reason was different. They said they wanted to go in a different direction, but really it was because no one clicked on the ads because most of the products were junk, and thus they lost money to the point where it was not profitable to keep going.

[EmiOfBrie]

I don't know of any IPs that still do this sort of thing, but it may be that the customer thought it was one of those deals.

PeoplePC used to do that too....I used to do tech support for them via DecisionOne. Support was easy because every customer had one of a selection of only a few machines.

[xaenon]

Their ad banner program was NOT in add/remove and neither was the watchware program that informed them of someone deleting the ads. The ads were constantly updated with new stuff and when it was updated that's when the watchware program would do its work.

As far as I know back then I was a novice myself LOL so that's probably why I got one, advanced users probably weren't interested in the program anyway as the machine given out was low-end (but to someone who never had a computer before it was great).

BTW, the reason they gave for merging with Emachines and the real reason was different. They said they wanted to go in a different direction, but really it was because no one clicked on the ads because most of the products were junk, and thus they lost money to the point where it was not profitable to keep going.

Okay, first of all, I'd like to apologize.

Rereading my original reply, I realized that the way I'd worded it implied that you were a novice. Believe me, that really was not my intent. Nor am I implying that 'novice' is a bad thing - everybody is a novice at some point, it's the first step to becoming an expert.

I promise I'll drink lots of alcohol on December 31st as penance. Hey, it will give me an excuse.

Now that we've got THAT out of the way....

I was not aware that FreePC had merged with Emachines. Makes sense, though, because I seem to remember that one of the 'national' ISPs had a deal where if you signed on with their service for like three years, they'd send you a voucher for like $300 toward the purchase of an eMachine - meaning you paid only like $200 for the hardware. Problem was, $200 was still too much to pay for an early Emachine, 'cause frankly they were junk. You were lucky if you got a year out of the thing before the tiny little power supply blew and took major components with it.

I guess it's true - you really do get what you pay for, and 'free' is often too expensive.

[draggar]

It had an AMD K6-2 375mhz with 64mb of memory and a 4GB hard drive. Not much, but you can't argue with free.

Personally, I would have simply installed a second hard drive, and installed Linux or an alternate copy of XP, as a dual-boot, only booting into the ad-infested windows for when I'm not really using it, and let them think I'm doing so...

Then again, I'm not your average windows user. Most people wouldn't think of that...

You'd put XP on that thing? I'd stick with Win98SE.

[ExiledV20]

I can't help but wonder if this is one of the reasons why my cable box (actually it's a TV-over-DSL but people don't understand what I mean unless I call it a cable box :P) allows me to surf the internet with the remote control; slowly and painfully and with MANY sites that don't render properly.

Dear God.
You're still using WebTV?