I want a refund cuz I say so!

[Lace Neil Singer]

This refers to an SC who insisted that she'd paid for petrol but none had gone into her car. She claimed that she'd put in fifty pounds but her gauge said that none had gone in. No, her gauge couldn't possibly be broken, it had to be the pump and we had to be cheating her! She was yelling at my colleague who was refusing her a refund, and I stepped in saying we had no authority to give her a refund so would she mind waiting for me to call up a manager?

Now, our managers are a tenacious lot. They have been told by Bruce the Big Boss NOT to give refunds to customers who make this claim as 99% of the time, the customer's gauge is broken. If the customer can provide proof that a) their gauge is working correctly and b) their tank is empty, then they can have a refund. So far, no-one has been able to do this, and this SC was no different. I called over the road and asked Axl to come over, explaining the circumstances. Axl immediately came over and dealt with the SC while we watched avidly. XD

The SC didn't like the fact that Axl was not instantly agreeing to giving her a refund and her raised voice could probably be heard in the next town. XD Eventually, when she realised that she wasn't going to get an instant refund, she resentfully agreed to get her car checked out. We haven't heard from her since, so I can safely assume that she was one of the 99% who had a broken gauge.

[dalesys]

Milady, the air's low in your head again...

[wolfie]

Now, our managers are a tenacious lot. They have been told by Bruce the Big Boss NOT to give refunds to customers who make this claim as 99% of the time, the customer's gauge is broken. If the customer can provide proof that a) their gauge is working correctly and b) their tank is empty, then they can have a refund.

What about case c), namely the amount the pump says it put in is more than (as documented in the owner's manual) the capacity of the fuel tank?

[DGoddessChardonnay]

What about case c), namely the amount the pump says it put in is more than (as documented in the owner's manual) the capacity of the fuel tank?

I would think that the pump would cut off when the tank gets full to prevent overfilling. Our little car does this - when I fill up the tank, the pump will make a loud catching sound and the fuel will stop flowing when the tank is full.

[ComputerNecromancer]

I would think that the pump would cut off when the tank gets full to prevent overfilling. Our little car does this - when I fill up the tank, the pump will make a loud catching sound and the fuel will stop flowing when the tank is full.

I think they meant that the tank is only 15 gallons, but the gas pump says it pumped 16. And there's no overflow of gas. In other words the *pump* is lying.

Mind you, gas pumps are supposed to get calibrated frequently to prevent that.

And then, of course, there are scammers who may have fitted a larger aftermarket tank on the car. Or who just pumped a few gallons into a gas can when no one was looking.

[Gizmo]

And then, of course, there are scammers

I also know a few people with cars that you have to be running the car for 10 minutes before the fuel gauge reaches the true level. So turn on car, complain to staff that its still "empty" and try to get a refund or get away without paying...

[Lace Neil Singer]

Then the garage you take it to will confirm this. Of course, if you're a scammer, you're not going to take your car into a garage. This is a business; we can't just take customers' word for it or else we'd lose money.

[dalesys]

I think they meant that the tank is only 15 gallons, but the gas pump says it pumped 16. And there's no overflow of gas. In other words the *pump* is lying...

The car manual (which nobody reads) figure for tank capacity is a "Minimum guaranteed capacity" of a production run. As built will be a bit larger and there is also an allowance for thermal expansion from a cool underground tank to a hot summer afternoon.

Given those facts, and experience of a few vehicles, I'd expect to see 5-15% "overage" possible.

12 gallon tank, run dry, pushed into station, filled, <14 gallons? OK.

I remember one of the other gas monkeys at Laddle Amelika pumping over 60 gallons of gasoline into the cab tank of a moving van... They usually only hold about 30...

There was no tank! Just a filler neck.

[mhkohne]

What about case c), namely the amount the pump says it put in is more than (as documented in the owner's manual) the capacity of the fuel tank?

This effectively never happens in the real world without someone mucking up the pumps. As mentioned elsewhere, you have to account for expansion, overfilling, etc, and beyond that the pumps just don't get that far out of calibration at an honest station - they break in lots of ways, but the metering system doesn't fall that far out of cal on it's own.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I can't speak for other petrol stations, but ours are checked extremely often. We have a sticker with the date of the last check on every pump to prove this. They're also cleaned often. However, as we all know, SCs are above such things as reading signs.

[notalwaysright]

I can't speak for other petrol stations, but ours are checked extremely often. We have a sticker with the date of the last check on every pump to prove this. They're also cleaned often. However, as we all know, SCs are above such things as reading signs.

I do look at the inspection stickers, but I really have no idea what they inspect. I just figured it was for safety, not accuracy. I went to one gas station that hadn't been inspected (or the sticker was not changed) in three years.

[Argabarga]

I'm sure there have been times where I've been led to pay for more than I actually should for something due to a compounding of tiny errors and miscalibrations in the devices that measure what I'm buying.

I don't get all bent out of shape over it because I know that it's equaled out by the times I've been led to pay for LESS than I actually should for the exact same reasons.

Life is too short to carry a measuring stick with you everywhere you go, absent malice, I can live with "close enough" outside of rare cases where lives are going to be lost if you get it wrong even just a bit. (wanna do the math on that estimated orbit trajectory? Or just eyeball it?)

[BrenDAnn]

I've actually had the "it pumped more than my damn tank should hold" SC happen to me. Of course, even a one gallon gas can will hold *shock* more than one gallon exactly. Scammer failed at scamming, just like in the OP. P.S., Lace, glad to hear your managers are that awesome!

[Lace Neil Singer]

Yeah, we're lucky that Big Boss Bruce has our backs on this, therefore all the under managers have, too, cuz they don't want to provoke wrath. XD

[mhkohne]

I do look at the inspection stickers, but I really have no idea what they inspect. I just figured it was for safety, not accuracy. I went to one gas station that hadn't been inspected (or the sticker was not changed) in three years.

I think the two big parts are verifying seals on anything that should be sealed and pumping a given amount of fuel into a known-good container. There was actually a clever scam someone did where they programmed the pumps to run slow at the start of the gallon, then speed up toward the gallon mark. So if you tested by pumping exactly one gallon (which was the standard test procedure), you'd get the gallon you want, but if you were stopping, say, at a 1/2 gallon, you'd get significantly shorted.

Worked for a while, till the inspectors wised up and started pumping random amounts.