D&D recap 1: Enabling EW Mom

[Hyena Dandy]

I'm putting this in one 'part' because its the part which was actually sucky, whereas the other parts are more silly.


Well, recently, at the D&D camp, there were these two kids who, for the lack of a better name, we shall call the 'whine' brothers.

This is being because they're... Well, not whiny, but very, VERY annoying.

They lack better names because, although I remember their last names, I never bothered learning the names of the kids in my group the last week except Peter, who I've had for the past several years, and Alex, who was my assistant DM this year. So I'll name them all after companions The Doctor has had. (Peter gets a nickname too)

Peter is River, because he knows more about the game than the guy who's running it.
The party's Sorceror is Rory, because he's a nice guy who's just trying to enjoy himself, but all this weird stuff keeps happening.
Whine Brother the Elder is Peri, because rather than being pro-active, he just sits there and expects other people to solve his problems.
Whine Brother the Younger is Jack, because as much as I want to kill him, I can't.

I don't ACTUALLY want to kill Captain Harkness, though. But I also can't kill him, so... Yeah.



Day 1 went alright. Peri, Jack, and Rory joined together with their mutual love of 4th edition, and stared at wonder at all the choices that 3.5 lets you have. There were 3 3.5 Players Handbooks at the table, but that's alright, because there were also 3 players who hadn't played before (Rory, Peri, and Jack) and one player (River) who knew a lot about the game and would be able to make his own character in a few minutes after the rest made theirs.

Day 2, with character creation out of the way, Peri and Jack decided the time was right to start being really stupid. Which, okay, that's fine. I'm used to players being idiots. Its practically the point of the camp. Rory was frustrated with the way they were acting, and kept asking them to stop and calm down. When they wouldn't, he flicked Peri, which is obviously a big no-no, but I never noticed and nobody ever told us.

Day 3, Peri and Jack's father came in, complaining about the way that his children had been treated by Rory. Mr. G (the head of the camp) and I called the kids together, and asked them if they wanted to switch groups, since they weren't getting along. They said they'd work it out.

Day 4: Much to absolutely nobody's surprise, they didn't work it out. Again, I wasn't shocked. But these kids were turning into a real menace, provoking Rory. They started singing 99 Bottles of Beer on the wall. I told them to stop. After I eventually had to YELL at them, they switched to "I Know A Song That Gets On Everybody's Nerves." They also at some point decided to slow down play by, whenever I gave a rule they didn't like, they said that that's not in the rules. I usually don't like slowing down play, so rather than pointing it out, I'd say that I was invoking Rule Zero (The DM is right, even when he's wrong.)

They said that there was a 'rule -3000' that meant that, actually, the DM is wrong, even if he's right. They were, as you can see, very frustrating children.

But the best part of the day came at the end. Their mother came in and started yelling at us because the other kid ('Rory') was 'abusing' her children. I tried to explain that they were just as much at fault as he was (not true, they were more at fault, but I didn't want to upset her.)

She told me to 'stop yelling' at her (I wasn't talking any louder than she was) and that I shouldn't have let the kids decide they wanted to stay in the group, I should have made them switch, and finally that I need to protect her children, they can't help that they're annoying, they have Aspergers.

NOW I got upset. So told her.

"Ma'am, /I/ have Aspergers. And unless the diagnosis has radically changed, it leads to difficulty with nonverbal cues. Grunting and rolling your eyes are nonverbal cues. The other kid repeatedly said "Please stop, I'm getting upset," and me saying "You have to stop now" are NOT nonverbal cues. Stop hiding bad behavior with that excuse."

The lady stopped for a moment, and said in a very passive-aggressive way "We'll just have to find another camp to go to next year." and left.

Heh... Sorry for not giving more of a shit about that, but the Lexington Community Education camps allow for 16 kids per camp. This week, we had 18 kids in the camp, and there was still a ten person waiting list.

Mr. G and I agreed that her not signing the kids up would be a good thing. And we think we figured out why they're so annoying. Mom doesn't correct them on anything.

I wish we could get the other annoying kid's parents to pull them out too.


Day 5: Everything calmed down, and we had a good, relaxing and running a (rather disjointed, but still fun) campaign. The whine brothers were shipped off to someone else's campaign, and replaced with another kid I've had for a long while. Day 5 was a good day.












Fucking EWs. Fun parts coming later, though.

[Kristev]

Oh my. What a mess.

[Magpie]

I really like it when people's excuses get shot full of holes by someone who dares to know something. Kudos to you for putting up with those kids though.

[Hyena Dandy]

Thanks.

I'm really hoping this one actually keeps up on her promise to take the kids out of the camp next year.

[fireheart]

I really like it when people's excuses get shot full of holes by someone who dares to know something. Kudos to you for putting up with those kids though.

I hate it when people just use Aspergers or ADHD as an excuse for their behaviour. Depression/Dysthymia I can understand.

[Sapphire Silk]

I have Asperger's as well. I have trouble understanding some verbal cues as well as the non verbal ones . . . but please stop, you're upsetting me isn't one of them. The real problem is difficulties in social interaction and understanding social rules. Empathy is also a problem.

My GM is very tolerant when I give him crap . . . but not that tolerant.

These kids might very well have been displaying symptoms . . . but that doesn't mean you should have to put up with poor behavior. People with Asperger's learn appropriate social behavior by example. Coddling bad behaviors just reinforce them. They'll have more social difficulties when they hit their teenage years. That mom is setting up her kids for a world of hurt when they reach that age when how their peers view them is everything. Believe me, they'll feel it.

[Magpie]

I acknowledge that yes, my Asperger's results in me being more annoying. But that mom encouraged her kids to use that as an excuse. I don't know if she honestly didn't know what the limitations were, or if she just didn't care, but like Panacea said, she has taught her kids to use it as an excuse.

There's the story of the new teacher, who tells the girl with Down's to go and get a paper towel and wipe up the mess she made. The other students are all trying to get the teacher's attention to explain that you can't ask her to do that, she has Down's Syndrome. The girl with Down's? She goes and gets a paper towel and cleans it up. People are going to live up or down to your expectations.

[Shalom]

I wonder how many of us, here, have Aspergers' or another autism spectrum disorder. Counting myself, there are 5 of us in this thread alone.

To the OP: Do you find that Aspies have more difficulty than the average neurotypical in building a character, or is it easier for them?

The lady stopped for a moment, and said in a very passive-aggressive way "We'll just have to find another camp to go to next year." and left.

"Perhaps you could find another camp for this year as well? We've got five campers waiting for each spot that opens up, and they're likely to cause less trouble than your kids."

[NotSoInnocent]

My youngest daughter is on the high-functioning end of the Autistic spectrum. Her behavior in public? Polite and well-mannered. As long as I recognize when things are becoming overwhelming for her (and she usually lets me know in an only slightly less than calm manner) we can leave the situation before she really can't control her reaction to the stress.

If we could ever afford to send her to a D&D camp, she would do just fine. She would be very quiet and would probably only interact with other kids for games, but she would -not- be deliberately antagonistic to any of the other players... and if she was getting overwhelmed, she'd be talking to the DM politely about taking a break to "ground and center".

I have the same expectations for her as I do for any of my other children. The only allowances that are made is the recognition that she needs time to acclimate to a new environment and that she needs slightly more attention to help her cope when she is getting overwhelmed.

That... woman... has no idea what she is setting her children up for in the future.

[HermitIX]

I am sure if I tried I could equate this bad behavior to the existence of 4e. Most bad things in the world are 4e’s fault if you work at it long enough.

:P

[Sapphire Silk]

I wonder how many of us, here, have Aspergers' or another autism spectrum disorder. Counting myself, there are 5 of us in this thread alone.

To the OP: Do you find that Aspies have more difficulty than the average neurotypical in building a character, or is it easier for them?



"Perhaps you could find another camp for this year as well? We've got five campers waiting for each spot that opens up, and they're likely to cause less trouble than your kids."

I know that I have a very difficult time building my characters. It drives my GM nuts It's not the rules that give me issues . . . it is how my characters are going to integrate into a campaign, what weaknesses they have and how they will be played . . . in other words the very problems of social interaction that Aspies have trouble with.

Speaking of which . . . I have to finish revising a character . . .

[Nurian]

Day 4: Much to absolutely nobody's surprise, they didn't work it out. Again, I wasn't shocked. But these kids were turning into a real menace, provoking Rory. They started singing 99 Bottles of Beer on the wall. I told them to stop. After I eventually had to YELL at them, they switched to "I Know A Song That Gets On Everybody's Nerves." They also at some point decided to slow down play by, whenever I gave a rule they didn't like, they said that that's not in the rules. I usually don't like slowing down play, so rather than pointing it out, I'd say that I was invoking Rule Zero (The DM is right, even when he's wrong.)

They said that there was a 'rule -3000' that meant that, actually, the DM is wrong, even if he's right. They were, as you can see, very frustrating children.

"Then I'm sorry you don't want to play. Go to <manager> and see if someone has an opening or if your parents can take you now."

The lady stopped for a moment, and said in a very passive-aggressive way "We'll just have to find another camp to go to next year." and left.

"Only please, Brer Fox, please don't throw me into the briar patch."

Even with kids like these, I still think your camp sounds like a lot of fun!

[Kristev]

You need a real dragon.

[zombiequeen]

I have a good friend with Asperger's, and he is only slightly more annoying than the rest of the guys. He doesn't understand the meaning behind threats though, so it can get awkward sometimes.

My husband has ADHD...he doesn't get subtlety at all, and he is very bad at knowing the limits of social interactions...i.e. don't describe your sex life to others, don't tell people when your wife is on her period, etc.

However, neither my hubby or his friend were raised to cope with their conditions, so they both are bad about it. Hubs I'm helping teach, and my friend is getting counseling, so they both are getting better.

These kids...are just out of bounds. Send them to my house, my mum will beat some sense into them (I wasn't beaten, just taught that if you do something wrong enough, you will get spanked). If she fails, I am apparently just a younger, more energetic version of her.

[NateTheChops]

I wonder how many of us, here, have Aspergers' or another autism spectrum disorder. Counting myself, there are 5 of us in this thread alone.

Six here.

And it burns me to no end when I hear someone or someone's relative using the diagnosis as their Get Out of Jail Free card. It's why people like my cousin are still living with their parents at 18 as a high school drop out with no intention of getting a job or their GED's.

I look at the apartment I rented for a year and the jobs I've held down and the fact that I am now currently in Salem, Mass, a place I've wanted to live in my whole life and I ask people, "Could I really have done all this if I used Asperger's as an excuse for not getting shit done?"

As for an Aspie having more difficulty in setting up a character, I don't know about that. I'm not a DnD player but I know plenty of Aspies who are into DnD and other table top role playing games.

To Hyena on The Doctor companions: I felt so sorry for Rory when he got removed from the time stream. That was the last episode I saw so don't spoil it for me if The Doctor found a way to bring him back or whatever.