"I'm buying books from now on! It's cheaper!"

[camjuniper]

Don't you love patron/customer (lack of) logic?

Hi! I'm Cam. Longtime reader & lurker, first time poster. I work in a small public library. Mostly I have absolutely lovely patrons, but this lady was a repeat offender and I just had to share.

First Encounter: You start too late!

SC looks at signs our Children's Librarian (CL) posted asking for Lego donations in order to start a Lego Club and one that said summer reading info would be out soon and it would start the end of June.

SC: You never start your summer reading early enough. By the time school's out and I get everything together you're always half over. That's why I go to Some Corporate BookStore.
ME: I'm sorry you feel that way, blah blah, smooth smooth, I'll pass on your comments to our children's librarian.
SC: [sour look] Well, when is the Lego club.
ME: CL is still looking for donations, no date set yet, probably to run with our Summer Reading program.
SC: Don't you know anything about it?
ME: It'll probably be geared towards ages X and Y [pulls other random info from casual conversations with CL].
SC: *catbutface*
SC leaves.

We're not early enough and you're always late? Ooohhkay . . . . Also, our CL visits the various Elementary Schools and sends how pamphlets and such, so either your kid/s isn't passing stuff on or you've just been ignoring it.

Fun-filled visit 2

I recognize Summer Reading/Lego Club SC from our first encounter (never had seen her before) when she came in last night. Summer Reading signups were on Tuesday night. Popular events filled up fast, including Lego Club.

SC: Tell me about Summer Reading. Where can I sign up.
Clearly she hadn't seen the LARGE SIGNS on the table in the kid's room, so I smilingly point her in the right direction, tell her it's for any age under 12 and if she's interested in the program for over 12, I'm the person to ask. Otherwise our CL is at her desk and is the best person to talk to.

SC wanders over to the table and wanders back to me in under 2 minutes.
SC: What about the Lego Club?
ME: Well, the first one was held today, but the CL would be able to answer any other questions. She's over at her desk, in the back to the right.

CL later tells me that SC complained that she comes to this library ALL THE TIME (and why did neither myself or the CL recognize you or your kids?) and she wants to sign up for the Lego Club (limit: 15 kids, all full). CL apologizes, says its on a first come first serve basis. SC bitches. CL stands her ground & repeats that signups were Tuesday and all events signups are first come first serve. (I love CL, she's a sweetie with the kids and is firm with any SCs).

So SC signs up her kids for Summer Reading and goes to my CW at the Circulation Desk to check out books. She also asks about our Museum Passes (you check 'em out, get into the museum/park/institute for a discount or free--they're awesome). We've got a limit of one per family at a time. We don't have a lot of them and really, you're probably only going to visit one anyway. You can also hold a pass for 24 hours, which mostly people do over the phone.

SC wants two passes. CW tells her she can have one. Well, can SC put one on hold? CW messes up and says we'll only hold the hold 'til the end of the day. Not a big deal (I corrected her later) since she tells her she can call in the morning to put it on hold. Fine. She'll take the Pass A and call tomorrow about Pass B.

Then CW scans her library card. She's got $27.95 in fines and billed items. Some books have been fined twice. This happens when you keep a book too long, renew, keep it too long a second time and the return it (you get one renewal unless the lending library will make an exception).

SC: Why am I being charged twice?
CW explains.
SC: That's ridiculous! You're penalizing people for renewing books.
CW: . . .
SC: I'm never renewing again! I'll keep the books!
CW: . . .
SC: I'm not paying it!
CW: Well, our limit for fines is $10. If you want to pay it down to $10 I can check out your items--
SC: That's it! No library books for us anymore, kids! It's too expensive! I'm buying books from now on! I'm never coming here again!
SC storms out with her kids.

[Ellf]

Okay... "It's too expensive" to check out books that you couldn't return on time? Does the SC have any idea how much new books cost?

[Marian_Paroo]

Okay... "It's too expensive" to check out books that you couldn't return on time? Does the SC have any idea how much new books cost?

Oddly, I don't think many people do. Honestly, we've had some patrons come in who think our entire collection is made up of books people or publishers donate to us.

No, really.

[MoonCat]

Welcome! The library is my second home...

Sounds like that one lady has a major problem reading signs and understanding library rules. Maybe she should sign herself up for a literacy course.

[xaenon]

Have ya ever noticed that the worst customers are the ones that rant and rave over something that's 'free'?

You borrow books from a library for FREE. It's only when you don't return them on time that any money is involved. Yeah, I've had my share of overdue books, but I've never bitched about having to pay the fines. After all, it's not the library's fault when the 'patron' doesn't return the things they borrow.

And, seriously, since when is it cheaper to BUY books than borrow them from the library? Assuming, of course, that you return them in a timely manner.

Oh, and declaring that she's going to keep the books? Wouldn't that be an admission of intent to commit THEFT? Or fraud, at the very least.

Sheesh.

[Krandor]

Have ya ever noticed that the worst customers are the ones that rant and rave over something that's 'free'?

Absolutely. I see so many demands and stuff from people to authors of programs and apps that are FREE. My favorite is "I demand you add feature X or I will never use your program again".... well, given that the program was free I doubt that threat will keep the author up at night.

[Indigo]

I've never understood people who whine about library fees. I have also known people try to bring back a book that's been totally destroyed and then get pissy about having to pay for it.

The most I've ever had to pay was when my puppy chewed up one of my library books. I sheepishly went back to the library, chewed book in hand, and asked them how much I owed them for it.

[Little Retail Rabbit]

Wow, that lady was very daft!

However, I do have to say that that renewal policy is very unusual to me. At my local county libraries, if you had a book, renewed it after it was late (but paid the fine) and then returned it late again you wouldn't be fined twice. Yes you'd be fined, but the renewal clears your previous loan. And although I could see some British councils considering that as another way to make money (as there have been massive library closures up and down the UK ) I bet people would be less inclined to use library services and support their libraries if they were fined double for a second late renewal/return.

Having said that, I do wonder JUST how late those books were! Its normal only for something like, what 10p 20p? something small to be accrued for every day past the return date? One time I had a bunch of books I returned late and my fine was £7, and I was positively shocked I had racked up a fine that high (I normally only made fines under a £1). Even with double fines she must have had that quite late to get that to $27!

I don't get fined much anymore. It was a bit of a running joke between me and my local librarian...I'd come in a few days after my return date, and we'd chuckle "Oh you're late again rabbit, never mind!". On one ocassion one shitty librarian really gave me a hard time about it and I was upset, but the cool librarian said "Oh ignore anyone who says that, you're supporting our library, and whats more, your fines are going to support us too, so think of it that way!" The same cool librarian made sure I was the first to know when a new online system became available- about 2 days before the date I get an email reminding me No more fines for me, so I guess I need to find a new way to give my library "donations"

(I love libraries. I want to be a librarian but none will take on an assistant for certification processes at this point, due to closures. I'm thinking of donating some of my unwanted books to them, as I'm a book hoarder but I would rather they went to a library than to a jumble sale).

[hotelslave]

Thanks for the post. Reminded me I had library books due today. Thankfully I can renew online instead of getting up and going

[vloglady]

I'm in NY, Children's LIbrarian. A kid under age 16 can Read Down their Fines. For every half hour a kid reads, they get a coupon for $1 off their fines. We want to encourage children to come to the library. Some kids have so much in fines, they'll never pay them and never come back.

[dragon_wings]

Currently I have like $4 or $5 in fines at my library cause I'm forgetful as hell. An until I pay them I'm kinda too embarrassed to borrow any more. Plus I don't have time to read (well I do but I do other things... Like come here. ). I bought the first three books in the Dreaden Files series like a month ago and I'm only 3/4 through the second.

[LibraryLady]

The Library in which I worked for over twenty years was a high-level research Library. In our field we were considered one of the top three in the world. We were certainly the best in the Western Hemisphere.

There was a time when there was an admission fee of the 'pay what you wish' sort for the Museum. If you were going to the Library, a call was made from the front desk, an appointment was confirmed and a paper pass was given to the Library patron. When money got tight, that had to stop because people were showing up at opening time and claiming that they had a Library appointment. They were then admitted and given a pass.

Wonder of wonders! They spent the day enjoying the museum and showed up at the Library in just enough time before closing to drop off their passes. Some never visited the Library at all and kept their passes for free admission to the Museum any time they wanted.

This had to stop. Eventually, the Museum decided that visitors using the Library had to pay admission. One habitual user was absolutely incensed when he heard this. He was coming to show his six year-old son this wonderful Library.

When asked to pay something at the front desk, he literally threw two pennies in the face of the clerk. Isn't that a wonderful lesson to teach a child?

When he reached the Library he was livid.

"This Library is extremely important to me! It is obscene to make me pay to use it!"

Please note that the man in question was wearing a very expensive suit, a very expensive watch and very expensive shoes. He could have easily afforded the 40 USD annual museum membership that would have given him and his child free admission to the Museum at any time.

[camjuniper]

However, I do have to say that that renewal policy is very unusual to me. At my local county libraries, if you had a book, renewed it after it was late (but paid the fine) and then returned it late again you wouldn't be fined twice.

Her problem was that she hadn't paid the first fine and now had two for several items!

The fines were a bit high--$5 twice for one item because it was a video game (not even borrowed from our library; we don't carry those), but it caps out at $5 for movies and video games and $3 for books. (per renewal, per item, per checkout)

And yeah, buying your books? Way more expensive than free ones! $27 will get you ONE new hardcover adult book.

I suspect if the sticker shock gets to her, she'll go to one of the other libraries in the consortium and pay up there rather than show up contritely to ours.

[taxguykarl]

Have ya ever noticed that the worst customers are the ones that rant and rave over something that's 'free'?

You borrow books from a library for FREE.

Technically paid for a indirectly--that is the largest non-school item on my property tax bill. But you're right customers pitch a major hissy fit over freebies--didn't they think they got their money's worth?

Oh, and declaring that she's going to keep the books? Wouldn't that be an admission of intent to commit THEFT?

Technically yes, as those tomes are city property--nothing to stop the librarian from sending law enforcement to pick them up.

[Ill_Used_Heroine]

Technically paid for a indirectly--that is the largest non-school item on my property tax bill. But you're right customers pitch a major hissy fit over freebies--didn't they think they got their money's worth?
Technically yes, as those tomes are city property--nothing to stop the librarian from sending law enforcement to pick them up.

Not to mention that if she just kept them, she'd probably get charged for them as Lost items. The previous library system I worked in charged you the full price for the item, plus a $5.00 Processing Fee, and a month's worth of overdue fines. There was a $10 fine limit there as well, and if your fines were more than 90 days old, they got turned over to a collection agency. Unbelievable as it sounds, we had some patrons that owed the system over $1000 for materials that were never returned.