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  • "Have You Learned Your Lesson?"

    I get the crazy ones. Boy, do I.

    So, SC shows up mid-May, wanting a rather large project done, but...budget-ty, so it's cheap. He insists this needs to be done SOON, as he wants to launch by mid June. Sure, can do, this is a 2, at worst 3 week project.

    As a strange aside, he insists that I hire on the coder he chooses, and pay them myself, so he can just pay one lump sum. I'm annoyed by this, but I have a surcharge for doing this sort of thing. Keep this in mind, it comes into play later: he wanted me to pay the coder he wanted to hire, for him.

    Get the 50% deposit, and then all the problems start.

    He cracked the whip and constantly insisted he needed this site "ASAP" at first, and then halfway through the design process, he proceeded to disappear for a week or more at a time. Suddenly he'd pop back up demanding to know why I was delaying the project.

    What should've been a 2, maaaaaybe 3 week project turned into 58 days, and I told him more than a few times that I could NOT sit and twiddle my thumbs over this. I informed him that to get his site finished, he had a deadline date to contact me back, which he completely missed. I actually was in the process of prepping the files for sale because I thought he'd abandoned the project.

    At one point, he sent me a very nasty email telling me to stop asking him to reply soon, because he had things to do, and that since he was paying me a "huge, trmendous sum compared to your stupid normal projects of, what, $200?" that I needed to learn to bend over backwards for "the bigger fish."

    I let him know in no uncertain terms that he was only paying $900. I have many, MANY clients who pay more, and just, in fact, landed a nearly $3k contract. He was not one of the bigger fish, and I take pride in the fact that I treat my clients all the same, no preferential treatment due to how much money you throw at me. I don't care about money, I care about attitudes.

    He's not thrilled with my reply, but says he'll get back to me soon.

    So, he finally shows back up, we get the design aspect completed, and due to his previous disappearance act, I requested that before I complete the rest of the project, I'd feel more comfortable with the second half of the payment. I don't like it when people bail on me like that, and it makes me feel like they're gonna leave me with a full custom design, tailored to them, and no buyer.

    He says he understands, and promises to send it that evening. Harr.

    A week after THAT, he finally pays, and I inform him that my coder cannot begin until a certain date (four days from that time), due to the schedule he now has for work. He demands that the work be done over the weekend, and I tell him no, coder has family priorities, and weekends are...well...weekends.

    He starts demanding to know why the site isn't done NOW, "coding is a simple quick job", and starts constantly harassing me asking why things aren't moving forward. This transpires up until the friday evening before the weekend.

    Granted, at this point, one bad thing did happen. The coder I hired tried to get in contact with him, he freaked out as "I shouldn't have to EVER speak to the coder". Well, that's kinda new. Hearing about this, the coder didn't go through with emailing him, and I said I'd just continue to handle the communications. I email client back, stating well, things are progressing like blah blah, please remember, things will be rolling on Monday, as coder has the weekend off.

    I guess this was the wrong answer.

    Saturday morning, the client disputed the second payment, and sent me a huge email claiming I was making up an "imaginary coder" and "stealing his money", and that he was going to hold the money hostage unless he heard from the coder in one hour, with proof of what progress had been made. he said this would "be a lesson" to me about being a professional, and about working with customers, and doing stuff for them even when its problematic for me/my hired on coders.

    I called up the coder, woke him up (to his chagrin, and apparently ticking off his girlfriend hardcore), and had him quickly fire off an email showing the progress that was done, and confirming that he wasn't imaginary.

    Unsurprisingly, client never replied to the email, until today.

    He did close the dispute, but not without posting a nasty email stating how "Isn't it sad that your unprofessionalism by delaying my project caused me to have to be the bad guy? Now you've learned for the future." Real class act. Unprofessional my butt.

    He also lectured me on the horribleness of me was to expecting him to reply promptly to emails, don't I know he has a life, and how it was all my fault I forced him to do this. And that, he won't hestitate to use these measures again if he deems that we're not working fast enough.

    I guess he has no clue that PP won't let you dispute the same transaction twice, which I'm grateful for, but cripes. Yes, I learned a lesson here, never working with him again, even for all the other projects he's been dangling in my face.
    By popular request....I am now officially the Enemy of Normalcy.

    "What is unobtainium? To Seraph, it's a normal client. :P" -- Observant Friend

  • #2
    Darn, I thought you were the one teaching the lesson.

    Well at least you won't have to deal with him ever again.

    SC
    "...four of his five wits went halting off, and now is the whole man governed with one..." W. Shakespeare, Much Ado About Nothing Act I, Sc I

    Do you like Shakespeare? Join us The Globe Theater!

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    • #3
      If it were me I would have just done a token refund and on-sold the work that had been done so far for as much as I could squeeze out of it. No amount of payment is worth putting up with an SC like that.
      Violets are blue,
      Roses are red,
      I bequeath to thee...
      A boot to the head >_>

      Comment


      • #4
        I can't _wait_ until the first problem he has and he frantically e-mails you for help, only to be told "Sorry, don't work for you anymore. Have a nice day!"

        Pawnade is best when drunk by the SC that made it! (copyright pending).

        Comment


        • #5
          Oh no, the minute he has a frantic request you can just hang him out to dry with his own words... Things to do, a life outside, etc.
          This was one of those times where my mouth says "have a nice day" but my brain says "go step on a Lego". - RegisterAce
          I can't make something magically appear to fulfill all your hopes and dreams. Believe me, if I could I'd be the first person I'd help. - Trixie

          Comment


          • #6
            Quoth RealUnimportant View Post
            Oh no, the minute he has a frantic request you can just hang him out to dry with his own words... Things to do, a life outside, etc.
            Make sure you include, "As your previous emails so eloquently stated:"
            A lion however, will only devour your corpse, whereas an SC is not sated until they have destroyed your soul. (Quote per infinitemonkies)

            Comment


            • #7
              This is an important lesson.

              One you can teach to the other people you're in contact with in your industry, so they don't make the same mistake you made in working with this EW.
              PWNADE(TM) - Serve up a glass today! | PWNZER - An act of pwnage so awesome, it's like the victim got hit by a tank.

              There are only Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse because I choose to walk!

              Comment


              • #8
                Your contract must have stated that an on-time delivery assumes the client responds within a reasonable time?

                Sadly, clients like this are more or less the norm. They will drag their feet on responding with feedback or answering questions until the day before it's due, and then they are upset that it's not finished on time.

                And I certainly wouldn't just take someone on board that a client asks me to hire. That's not part of the contract. They are hiring me to do something for them. If someone is a subject matter expert or a guy the client trusts, then keep that person on their side. Taking a client's own developer to do a project can open you up to complexity and complications.

                Although I would have never expected a client to completely forget about that developer. I feel bad for him that he has to return to that bonehead.
                Fiancee: We're going to need to do laundry. I'm out of clean pants.
                Me: Sounds like a job for Gravekeeper!
                Fiancee: What?!
                Me: Nevermind.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I really enjoy your stories (in addition to similar first-person accounts from clientsfromhell.net), but I've gotten to thinking: When you take on a client for such a task, can you devise your own contract as far as the explicit terms and conditions regarding "calls will be made between the hours of x and x", or, "the project can be cancelled per me if the business conduct on the buyer's behalf is deemed unacceptable, including threats, harrassment, etc"? Yeah, it would probably narrow down the clients you DO get, but on the other side of the sword it'll also eliminate a certain percentage of the headaches and wasted time.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Quoth emax4 View Post
                    I really enjoy your stories (in addition to similar first-person accounts from clientsfromhell.net), but I've gotten to thinking: When you take on a client for such a task, can you devise your own contract as far as the explicit terms and conditions regarding "calls will be made between the hours of x and x", or, "the project can be cancelled per me if the business conduct on the buyer's behalf is deemed unacceptable, including threats, harrassment, etc"? Yeah, it would probably narrow down the clients you DO get, but on the other side of the sword it'll also eliminate a certain percentage of the headaches and wasted time.
                    I doubt it would narrow down the clients Saraph gets, since I bet none of them read the damn contract. Chances are Saraph will continue to get the same idiots, but this time she's at least more safe from a legal standpoint if they decide to lash back with lawyers.

                    Plus, SCs rarely know they're SCs. This guy probably didn't consider his behavior threatening or harrassing, and thus would still sign the contract even if he read it.
                    Fiancee: We're going to need to do laundry. I'm out of clean pants.
                    Me: Sounds like a job for Gravekeeper!
                    Fiancee: What?!
                    Me: Nevermind.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Okay, yeah.

                      First, Seraph needs soda pop and five guys burgers, stat!

                      Second, I'd tell other designers to watch out for him.

                      Third, I'd banhammer him. (Well a girl can dream)

                      Seriously if someone buying a quilt was acting like that...I'd let him get his refund and not take another order from him. Then again I am a cranky bear today.
                      https://purplefish-quilting.square.site/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Quoth Jay 2K Winger View Post
                        This is an important lesson.

                        One you can teach to the other people you're in contact with in your industry, so they don't make the same mistake you made in working with this EW.
                        Already posted a diff version of this where the people in that industry can see it, to warn others. Someone already commented on it that boy, I must have a target painted on me. Yep, already infamous with them for my bad customers... -.-

                        Quoth thehuckster View Post
                        I doubt it would narrow down the clients Saraph gets, since I bet none of them read the damn contract. Chances are Saraph will continue to get the same idiots, but this time she's at least more safe from a legal standpoint if they decide to lash back with lawyers.

                        Plus, SCs rarely know they're SCs. This guy probably didn't consider his behavior threatening or harrassing, and thus would still sign the contract even if he read it.
                        Exactly. They never, EVER read anything, even though I have a really concise and clear terms of service that everyone has to agree to.

                        Quoth Kanalah View Post
                        Okay, yeah.

                        First, Seraph needs soda pop and five guys burgers, stat!

                        Second, I'd tell other designers to watch out for him.

                        Third, I'd banhammer him. (Well a girl can dream)

                        Seriously if someone buying a quilt was acting like that...I'd let him get his refund and not take another order from him. Then again I am a cranky bear today.
                        First, no kidding. Pity I've cut soda out. -.-

                        Second, done.

                        Third, he's out as soon as this is done.
                        By popular request....I am now officially the Enemy of Normalcy.

                        "What is unobtainium? To Seraph, it's a normal client. :P" -- Observant Friend

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Quoth Kanalah View Post
                          Okay, yeah.

                          First, Seraph needs soda pop and five guys burgers, stat!
                          And don't forget the fries, those awesome fries.

                          We jus tgot a second one here, on our side of town - bad news for my diet

                          Madness takes it's toll....
                          Please have exact change ready.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Quoth Seraph View Post
                            Exactly. They never, EVER read anything, even though I have a really concise and clear terms of service that everyone has to agree to.
                            Presumably including the "no harrassment" clause that emax4 suggested.

                            thehuckster is also right: SCs rarely realize that they're being sucky. This guy probably thinks he's a "shrewd, skillful businessman" who's being "persuasive" and "getting things done", instead of a tantrum-throwing, arrogant, condescending, demanding spoiled brat. I hope you've got his e-mails saved up in case the ass tries something really nasty.
                            I don't have an attitude problem. You have a perception problem.
                            My LiveJournal
                            A page we can all agree with!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Seraph:

                              Credit to you on this one: you have a lot more patience then I imagine I would if I was in your position. I think I would have tossed 'em a refund and sang "Hit the Road Jack" a long time ago.

                              By the way, thanks for all the tales you post. I always enjoy reading your stories, if for no other reason then you can respond to your customers in a way I never could. Though every time I read about your latest trials and tribulations, I'm reminded of VCR and CustomersRuinMyLife: All three of you seem to have this uncanny ability to attract customers that make one's jaw drop and think "Train wreck."
                              Be a winner today: Pick a fight with a 4 year old.

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